Hey everyone, I'm hoping someone on here can help me out...

This is the second time in the past few months that my computer has crashed. The first time around, everything had been working fine... but one night, I left my computer on (like I always did), but woke up the next morning to a black screen. Tried restarting the computer and nothing. I ended up deleting my entire C drive (sigh) and starting from scratch. I reinstalled windows. I thought everything was OK, but then the same thing happened the other night. Went to sleep, everything was fine, woke up to a broken computer. This time, when I tried restarting it the first time, it said it would not find the Operating System. I tried again later, and it would go to the Windows 98 start up screen and freeze. Also, while starting up the computer, I hear a kind of buzzing noise coming from the tower. Since the same thing happened twice, I can only conclude that when I "fixed" it last time, it worked for a while, but then did the same thing again... Is it a hardware problem? Is something wrong with my hard drive perhaps? Or my memory? Or my motherboard? Could it be a virus?? I read somewhere about some FAT32 something or another, and one time when I booted up the computer, a black screen with writing ALL over it came up and it had words and links and weird symbols (a smiley face in a rectangle, a spade, arrows, backwards E's, etc...). What exactly is FAT32? I'm asking all these questions - you computer experts are probably thinking "ugh, what a dummy". http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif I'm trying to learn, I swear! Anyways, ANY help/advice/comments would be extremely helpful, because right now I have a dead computer and it's just ... really sad. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif THANKS!!!! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

*Allison*
AQUASUN1

First off...Welcome http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

We're off to a good start here with the info you have provided, but we're gonna like some additional data to slim down our choices:

Tell us a little more about your system, like Brand, New or Old, RAM, HD size and Brand if you know it, CPU speed & type (Pentium, AMD, Cyrix, etc.)
Now, have you installed any software or hardware lately? Have you moved the system or had the case open lately? Any power outtages or surges that you know about?
Tell us a little bit about the reinstall of Windows...did you reformat the hard drive and run FDISK etc or something else?
Initially, I'm thinking a check of the seating of your peripherals and components like RAM, Video Card, mouse, keyboard etc. Could be power supply is going out on you.

Try to answer some of your questions here: the buzzing noise could be the hard drive, cd-rom or one of your fans inside the case.
FAT32 is a type of file system much better explained here: http://www.pcguide.com/ref/hdd/file/file.htm
More than likely you are using FAT32 in Windows 98.
Can you boot using a start up disk? If so, you can check of a virus using a program that fits on a floppy (MJC help me here...)
The funny characters you saw on your screen are known as ASCII characters and you can learn about that here: http://webopedia.internet.com/TERM/A/ASCII.html

Hang around and more help will be here. Check all the connections on the pc exterior first, then if you are comfortable inside the case (discharge yourself of static electricity first) you can check the seating of those things mentioned. You can also see if you fans are working. One other thing I can think of is to enter the bios and disable power management there and if/when you can get to windows disable it as well by going through the control panel.
Post back...

ps-I like your screen name http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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savoire faire ist everywhere...

[This message has been edited by bassvax (edited 05-06-2001).]

The anti-virus is f-prot (http://www.f-prot.com/) BUT get it from BootDisk (http://www.bootdisk.com) because they did the hard work (putting it on a floppy -- the instructions how are in the f-prot download, from f-prot, but.....)

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mjc
Links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

All Control Agents must memorize Rule 5 before proceding to Rule 6

Thank you for your fast and detailed response! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

I'll try to give you as much info as I can...

Brand: Gateway
Purchased: January '99
RAM: 32MB
HD size: 3.2GB
CPU speed: 366 Mhz
CPU type: Intel Celeron

I have not installed any software or hardware lately.
I have not moved the system or had the case open lately.
No power outtages or surges that I know of, but I originally thought it was a power surge that caused it (I do have a surge protector, if that helps).

I did reformat the hard drive and I recall running something to do with FDISK, but that is because I tried a number of things, I don't remember specifically...

"The buzzing noise could be the hard drive, cd-rom or one of your fans inside the case." ---
I think it is the hard drive rather than the fan mainly because it only makes that sound when the computer is "working" (processing information), when not trying to do anything, I only hear the fan. But, I could be wrong http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif.

I tried booting up with my Boot Disk. It says that there is an error with the C drive and asks if I want to abort, retry, fail...(this is identical to the problem I had last time).

I did know about the ASCII characters - I was just wondering if those specific ones meant anything. Could it have just been a random splurge of information that popped up? (Thanks for the links!!)

I have installed HW previously, and can find my way around the internals of a computer, but I may need some very specific directions of what to do http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif.

"One other thing I can think of is to enter the bios and disable power management there and if/when you can get to windows disable it as well by going through the control panel." --- Not sure how to go about that from this point exactly...

I hope this info helps some. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge with me! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

Thanks again ... I'll be checking for your responses!

*Allison*
AQUASUN1

Frequently when the video card is intializing it will display random ASCII caharacters, so if it is hanging with the characters displayed there may be a problem with the video card drivers, also from Bootdisk you can download several different disks.

Have you run scandisk?

Can you boot into DOS? (<f8> while booting, after POST/ BIOS logo). If you can try running scandisk in DOS.

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mjc
Links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

All Control Agents must memorize Rule 5 before proceding to Rule 6

Ok, I ran scandisk ... the first time (in Safe Mode Command Prompt Only) -it said "Scan disk is unable to check a drive because there is no extended memory driver loaded on your computer...check that you have a HIMEM.SYS file." - so then I tried it again in the regular Command Prompt and all it found was an invalid long file name.

I also performed a surface scan, and a message came up towards the end that said:

"Some data is stored in a damaged area of Drive C, and might already be lost. This problem is probably causing data errors."

I chose to fix the problem, so that it could move the damaged cluster to a space where I can't add data to it - right after that, it seemed to freeze and it's now stuck at "94% complete" ... though the light is blinking ocassionally, so maybe its working VERY slowly? I plan on leaving it on for a while to see if anything happens. I will update you later on progrss if any ... please give me any new suggestions! Thanks again http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif.

UPDATE:
The surface scan never completed, so I was forced to exit it (which I had to do by turning off the power, because CTRL ALT DEL wouldn't work...).

I don't know what to do now. Any more advice would be greatly appreciated! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

Welcome, AquaSun! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Try this --

Power down, put boot disk in drive A: and power up

The prompt on the screen should now be A:\

Type COPY C:\*.* NUL: (put a space between the * and the N, and a ':' (colon) after the L)

The copy operation should run and the last line should be 1 file(s) copied

If it is not, and you get the Abort/Retry/Fail error message,
there is most likely a problem with the system files.

At the A: prompt, type sys c:, then press Enter

You should get the message 'system files copied'

Repeat the 'Copy' step above.

If you get any other different error messages, copy them down and put it in your next reply.



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"I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
-- Charles Babbage, mathematician, computer pioneer, analytical engine designer (1791-1871)

Hi there- http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/cool.gif

I did the "COPY C:\*.* NUL:", and the last line did say "1 file(s) copied."

As for the "At the A: prompt, type sys c:, then press Enter
You should get the message 'system files copied'" ... I did that and it said "Bad command or file name."

¿What should I do next?

It sure sounds like a dead hard drive to me..........try running f-disk to see if it finds the drive........then run dir to see whats on the C drive. If it cant find the drive......your problems have probably all along been a dying hard drive.

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Will XP save Me ?

I ran fdisk and a bunch of options came up asking if I wanted to create, set, delete or display partitions ... I chose display, and then escaped because I didn't know if I should do anything else in there. I ran dir on the C drive and it did list files. But it also listed files the last time my computer broke down too. Are there some specific files I should be looking for?

What (if anything specific) causes hard drives to crash?

And how can I be sure it is just my hard drive that is causing all these problems?

Thanks! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif

Let's try again.

Power down, put the boot disk in drive A: and power up.

At the A: prompt, type COPY C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\SYS.COM A:/V
(space between M and A), then Enter

Response should be: 1 file(s) copied

If so, now type SYS C: then press Enter

Response should be: system files copied

(for the next ones, put a space between * and N, and the : after the L )

If so, type COPY C:\*.* NUL: (Response should be: 1 file(s) copied)

If so, type COPY C:\WINDOWS\*.* NUL: (Response: 1 file(s) copied)

If so, type COPY C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\*.* NUL: (Response: 1 file(s) copied)

If so, type COPY C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\*.* NUL: (Response: 1 file(s) copied)

Assuming you got no error messages along the way, what all this has done so far is:
copy the System command to the floppy disk, refresh the system files on the hard drive,
and verify that all the files in the root, Windows, Windows System, and Windows System32 folders
are valid and accessible. If you did get error messages, send them in your next reply.

Now remove the floppy disk, and restart your PC. As soon as it starts to boot,
press the Control key and when the menu comes up, choose 'Safe mode command prompt only'

At the prompt, type SCANDISK and select 'Thorough'. Let it run to check the hard drive again.
Even if it runs all the way through without errors, I think that 'buzzing noise' you mentioned earlier
is a good sign that this drive might be starting to fail, like Randy said. And once they start,
it's all downhill from there. You should prepare for the worst, and back up any documents you created. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif

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"I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
-- Charles Babbage, mathematician, computer pioneer, analytical engine designer (1791-1871)



[This message has been edited by tjaymadison (edited 05-08-2001).]

Ok, I did everything you said, and everything checked out until:

If so, type COPY C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\*.* NUL:

It said ZERO file(s) copied.

I guess that means Win System32 is missing or not accessible?

I didn't run SCANDISK again because I wasn't sure if I should since I got an error message...

Do you think it sounds like it's most likely a hard drive problem? Or could it possibly be something else... I wouldn't mind just getting a new hard drive if that would fix the problem. I don't really have anything to lose on the HD right now, because I deleted my entire C drive last time this happened (about 3 months ago)... http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif

[This message has been edited by AquaSun1 (edited 05-08-2001).]

Wow! I goofed! Sorry! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/redface.gif Try it this way --

COPY C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\DRIVERS\*.* NUL:

Now if it responds 1 file(s) copied, do the scandisk.

It may be a mechanical problem, but if not why spend the money? You'll have more info after the scan.

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"I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
-- Charles Babbage, mathematician, computer pioneer, analytical engine designer (1791-1871)

Ok, I ran Scandisk again, and it says the same thing as it did last time...

"Scan disk is unable to check a drive because there is no extended memory driver loaded on your computer...check that you have a HIMEM.SYS file."

Help?

http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/eek.gif

Boy, this post is so long, it's getting hard to follow.

If your PC will boot all the way into Windows, do this:

Click Start > Shutdown, click the button for Restart in MS-DOS mode and click the OK button.

At the prompt type SCANDISK and press Enter.

If you still get error messages and "Do you want to repair ..." kind of messages, answer No.

When it's done, and asks to do a surface scan, answer Yes.
If it still finds bad clusters, it's probably toasted. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif


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"I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
-- Charles Babbage, mathematician, computer pioneer, analytical engine designer (1791-1871)

My computer does not go all the way into Windows. It freezes on the screen that says "Windows 98." But I ran scandisk again anyways from DOS (surface scan again) - and the bad cluster it found last time was still there ... and guess what? It froze at 94% complete again ... this time though, I thought it would have just skipped over the Bad cluster since it was previously marked with a "B" and finish the surface scan. Maybe that part of my hard drive is just ruined? Since it stops right at the bad cluster?

...any suggestions on which hard drives I should choose from? http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif

I really hope replacing the HD works. If not, I'll be back on here whining again. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif

Thanks for all your help!

Well, you have a few choices.

If you can access the files you created in the My Documents folder or anywhere else by using
Windows Explorer, you can copy them to floppy disks. If any of them are on the damaged area of
the disk, they're history. You should try to do this anyway, regardless of what choice you make.
You will not be able to use this method to save any programs you have installed.

Then you could just keep running, and wait for the disk to die completely before replacing it.
If your PC boots more often than it hangs, you may get some more use out of it for a while.
You take the risk of your PC dying in the middle of something important this way. Even if
the hard drive starts to develop more bad clusters, it sounds like it's already pooched anyway.
You might want to just do this while you wait for a sale at CompUSA, Best Buy, or shop online.

Or after you try to save what files you can, you can start all over with a fresh FDISK and FORMAT,
to see if it's just ScanDisk stuck in some kind of a loop where it can't get past this bad cluster
to lock it out. If this works, there's no guarantee that this same kind of problem won't crop up again
in the future. How long? Anybody's guess. Hours, days, weeks. Longer?

Or you can just bite the bullet and go get a hard drive and install it. This is obviously the most
straightforward approach. It depends on your wallet, and your patience when the machine acts up.

If it was me, I'd save all the files I could, make two start-up diskettes, test them to be sure they work,
and go with the FDISK/Format. If it didn't complete the formatting, I'd replace the drive.

One last thing, if you do keep running. If the drive starts really howling, shut down.
If the motor binds up, you may trip the fuse in the power supply.

Decisions, decisions. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif

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"I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
-- Charles Babbage, mathematician, computer pioneer, analytical engine designer (1791-1871)

Well, I don't know how exactly I can get into Explorer without being able to log on completely... I can only get into DOS. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif I am going to try and save some of the files off the hard drive onto a disk using DOS though. As far as using Fdisk again and me being patient, well, being as this is the 2nd time this has happened, I have become very angry at this hard drive and would like to just get rid of it! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif Considering it's already happened twice, I don't think I want to risk it doing it again because it is definitely a big inconvience to go without my computer for so long (I'm on my back-up "Compaq Presario" which is very slow)... Anyhow, I will take your advice on trying to find a good deal on a hard drive. I'm gonna research them a little before I make a decision. Thanks so much for all your help!! Wish me luck http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Ok now that every body has explaned how to fix this problem I hope this will help explain what might have caused it.If I read correctly?? You said you had a surge protector. This may not be enough protection I live here in the land of TVA plenty of power and not to expensive. But there is a catch at night when there is not much of a demand thay will drop the amount of voltage you recive, normally during the day you recive 115v+ which is the way most things are made to run. But at night TVA drops the amount to 105v-110v there by keeping the cost down. this creates havoc in computers and refrigeration compressors( I work in HVAC) I have worked on 2 harddrives that this has happend to. surge protectors work good for a surge but thay do not help with a brown out you may want to try a good UPS that has voltage regulation.