I would like to thank you in advance for any and all help you are able to give http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif OK, Here is what I have: P5SS-Me Mainbord (ATX),AMD-K6-2 3D Processor, Award Bios , 64MB Memory , 8 GB Generic IDE Hard drive (type 46), Generic NEC floppy drive, and an Atapi CD-ROM 50X. Lets see...and I was using the onboard video and sound. The power supply I couldnt tell you for sure without totally dismantling my computer once again but I do know it only has the power connector for ATX-1. OK, to start out with, my computer had been running fine for quite some time. I hadn't recently installed anything or opened it up at all in the last four or so months. The power supply fan had begun to get a little noisy towards the end but I think that was probabely due to one of the screws holding it on to the back of the case being loose because that went away after I tightened it. However, It was only later that day or the next when my daughter was online and got some sort of error message. I dont know what kind unfortunately because she didnt read it, but when she went to sign off the computer froze, so she just turned it off and went to bed. The next morning when I turned it on, there was power but no video,no sound, and the cd-rom light was staying continually lit. I do know there is nothing wrong with the monitor...In fact I used the troubleshooter on this site which narrowed it down to the fact that I was in a tough spot of having a system that wont boot with no apparent reason why. I checked the motherboard for any loose cables, power plugs, or missing jumpers, checked the memory modules to make sure they used the same metal as the sockets they were in, and reseated the processor in case it was loose . I had tried many other things before reading the troubleshooter but up until I did these last things nothing had changed. However, after I did do these last things I turned the computer back on and had no power whatsoever. I did doublecheck everything again but everything seemed snug in its place. Now what Im wondering is if this series of events points to a particular component at all , and if the opinion is that its the power supply (which I did not check by shorting the green wire to the black because Im pretty new and quite scared of electricity) will I be able to use one of the other ones I have if they are pretty much the same aside from the fact that they have both the atx-1 and atx-2 connectors? Or if not, Is it possible to take the Hard drive off of that computer and install it in this one (A Dell Optiplex GL 575) as the master so I can maybe read the system history or boot log in an effort to find out what happened? Or will the different driver information cause trouble ? I wish I could just take it in somewhere but due to the fact that I live in a small town with no computer repair shop (and ahem..moneys a little tight right now anyway) I would welcome any information at all regarding this problem. Any at all! Thanks Again
Crystal

Hello Crystal and welcome to the PC Guide,
From your description of events, I would tend to think it is the power supply. Do you have access to a voltmeter? If so, you can test the voltage on the individual lines coming out of the PSU. Black is ground, Red is 5V, Yellow is 12V.
As for using and old PSU, I personally believe this should only be done in a 'life or death of the computer' situation. Old, used electronic parts have a tendency to not live very long.
With that said http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif you basically have to visually examine the unit to see if the dimensions will work in your case. Are height, width, and depth =? If similar but not exact, does the case allow for any play? Will the wires reach their connectors? I have one (we call him Frankenstien) that the power switch cable (AT style) was 1 inch to short, so I put the switch out the back of the case http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif
The next thing to consider is, will this other PSU supply enough power for your system.
It sounds as though you have enough experience to do this, but I must say, Please be careful about electro-static discharge! With no PSU and power cord connected to the case, it is not grounded and is extremely susceptible to static shock! http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/eek.gif
Hope this helps


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If I tell you to think for yourself, then you're not doing it.
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.
This is not directed at those asking questions in order to gain knowledge. That shows you are thinking.

http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif Thankyou, yes...this does help somewhat. The problem is that I do not have a lot of experence. I only got my first computer about a year ago and was as computer illiterate as anyone could possibly be, (lol, I had someone drive in from another town to install AOL for me!) but thanks to the fact that this newer one I got about 5 months ago didnt work right but came with the motherboard manual and the fact that my library happened to have a copy of "Upgrading and Repairing PCs" I have managed to learn just enough to fix and keep both computers running up till now. The problem is that even if I've read for ten hours on a particular problem, I dont always trust my own understanding of the subject because I feel my knowledge isnt very well rounded. Basically, I just wanted to try one of the other PSUs long enough to determine if that was indeed the problem before going out to buy another one. Also, I seem to have trouble finding info in these books that clearly answers(in a way that I can understand anyway:rolleyes http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif some of my seemingly more simple questions such as with the harddrive. Would it be possible for me to replace (or hookup as a slave) the Hard drive in this Dell with the one from my dysfunctional PC in an effort to search for what might have happened just before it died? Or would there be a problem because of the different component and driver information? (Dang, I cant seem to keep these postings short!) I thank you again for your help http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif
Crystal

QUOTE: "will I be able to use one of the other (power supplies) I have if they are pretty much the same aside from the fact that they have both the atx-1 and atx-2 connectors?"
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Those sound like AT power supplies, which would not be interchangeable with an ATX supply.

I don't think there is any information that could be found on the hard drive that would give a clue to what happened before it failed. A bad power supply seems to be the likely suspect at this time. If a noisy fan goes quiet on its own, it may have seized, which could then have caused the power supply to overheat.

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reido@my-deja.com

Friends don't let friends install Windows ME


[This message has been edited by Reid (edited 09-22-2001).]

If those power connectors are marked P8 & P9, they're AT connectors. If you have those AND a single ATX connector, twice as wide and twice as long, maybe it would work at least long enough to test it. I've never heard of any marked ATX 1 and ATX 2...that doesn't mean they don't exist...just that I'm not aware of them...

I'm in agreement with Reid, I doubt if you would find anything on the hard drive that would point to what caused the problem, and it sounds like a bad power supply to me too.

You can hook up the drive as slave to the drive in the functioning machine, and it shouldn't cause any problems, you would have to make sure and set BIOS to autodetect, and set jumpers on the drives to make the original drive master and the one you're installing slave. However I don't think it's going to be worth it, you're not likely to find any useful info from it. If you were to hook it up as master, or as a single drive, then you would have possible issues with motherboard related drivers, since it would be the boot drive.



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Thanks for the replies http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif As far as my PSU goes, It does only have the power cable for the ATX-1 power connector, however...my motherboard has the option for an ATX-2 power connector as well. I dont have that one installed on the motherboard (just an empty space where it would go if I needed it) but apparently I am only supposed to plug a power cable into that if I am also installing a 1394 serial device. Does this change anything? A couple of the other PSUs I have do have the same power specifications and the same type of plugs, The only difference I can really see is that they come with power cables for both the ATX-1 and ATX-2 connectors. I know at least one of them does have the plugs labeled with P8, P9, though. The Dell i'm on now has that type too. Anyway, just had to take one more shot. If the answer is still that I shouldnt use them then I guess I'll just have to admit to myself that Im in denial about how simple this is going to be and start trying to find out where to go to buy a new one huh? I do feel a little better though knowing that everyones pretty sure it is power supply thats the problem.

Hi Crystal,
As Reid and Pete mentioned, AT and ATX are the typical connectors. I too have never heard of ATX1 and ATX2. AT connectors are either 1 or 2 (P8,P9) pieces, thin, with a single row of pins. ATX is more of a block with 2 rows of pins side by side. I know I have seen PSUs with both but, I can't say I have seen mobos with both.
The purpose of PSUs having both was, they were made during the changeover from (older style) AT mobos to (newer) ATX mobos.
I go into this detail because you seem to be interested in learning and I want to make sure you are understanding what you are reading.
If we are off base and you have some documentation on the ATX 1&2 or you could describe them, that would be very interesting.
Please don't take it the wrong way,but, when Reid and Pete say they haven't seen it, I gotta lean with them http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif
And yes, If you have the correct plugs, correct dimensions, and similar power rating, then one of the other PSUs should work fine. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/cool.gif

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If I tell you to think for yourself, then you're not doing it.
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.
This is not directed at those asking questions in order to gain knowledge. That shows you are thinking.

Yep, as long as the motherboard does work without ther ATX 2 plugged in, the others should work at least for testing, and the ones with both AT and ATX connectors should work too. The main consideration will be wattage, but for testing purposes you only need motherboard, video card, CPU, memory and keyboard plugged in, to see if it does get power and video, if you need to check further plug in only the floppy and hard drive, a 250W power supply should handle it for a short test. I'd say go ahead and try one, as long as it has ATX connector it should work for testing, but depending on wattage, maybe not for long term use.

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Support the right to keep and arm bears.
Note: Please post your questions on the forums, not in my email.

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LOL,Hi Bassman and Pete

OK, Here's my explanation...I have the P5SS-Me Mainboard User's Manual (and I've seen the actual Mainboard of course) which has a diagram of everything on the motherboard along with instructions on installing the board as well as everything else right down to the last Jumper. I'll just type in the instructions it gives pertaining to plugging in the power supply...here goes:

1. Locate the power connector ATX-1. Connect the power cable from the power supply unit to ATX-1. The connector is keyed so that it can only be installed correctly.
2. Locate the serial bus device power connector ATX-2. If you are installing a 1394 serial device, connect the power cable from the device(oooohhhh...oops) to this connector.

Well, I didnt much pay any attention to that "from the device" part before I guess. The power cable for the ATX-1 connector is the block type though with two rows of 10 pins....The ATX-2 looks like it's a block type too (because the diagram even shows where it's keyed to plug it in correctly) but only has two rows of 3 pins.

When I went to get my motherboard book just now though I came across a print-out I did on the Dell GL 575 motherboard and although the power connector(only 1 on this one) is just labeled 'power' It looks exactly the same as the ATX-1 connector for the P5SS. Two rows of ten, and If I remember correctly it is a block type power connector too, but I know it has the P1-Pwhatever labeled on its plugs. hmmmm Anyway, I know I do have one power supply that has both the single type connectors and the block type on it. I wish I had them right in front of me, but their in a box (under 3 other boxes, and behind a couch lol) in the garage...maybe I'll go get them after all (almost did when I first read your replies but when I saw where they were, well...) so I can get a more educated guess on whether they will work or not. To tell you the truth, I cant say whether or not their even good. I got them from my mother who a while back moved in with her boyfriend and convinced him that he should get rid of all his "junk". I had told her about (bragged actually... I was quite proud of myself) How I took everything apart on this newer computer(which didnt work), formatted both it's Hard drives , Installed the 4GB one onto my old Dell computer, put everything back together, reinstalled everything and had both of them working great(still bragging I think, lol...But I felt that was pretty damn good considering I couldnt even install AOL 6 months earlier) so she asked me if I wanted all the computer stuff that was lying around and I said sure. Anyway though Its been a couple of weeks since I last looked at those PSUs because I wasnt totally sure if it was a PSU problem then and since they all had Cables to plug into two places on the motherboard I just decided to wait on testing that and went to see if I could find more info before using them. OK, Well, I'll go dig those out and come back in a bit. By the way...You guys should get paid for this stuff If you dont already. Before I got that Upgrading and Repairing book I tried getting help from techs on much simpler stuff for the Dell and not one of them was actually helpful! Seems like 10 different techs or so, and some of them had that screen sharing thing along with different diagnostic tests they could run on your PC. They totally ignored anything I said, wasted a bunch of my time, then I ended up fixing the problems myself!!! Thank God they were free trial things I guess. Anyway, you guys are being incredibly helpful...Just want you to know its appreciated http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

Too bad there isn't a really embarrassed smilie icon...sheesh! OK, Well those PSUs in my garage are definately the AT Style but in my own defense I'd like to add that I do remember bringing in the one I thought most likely to work. Only I put that one in a 'safe place' somewhere for the safety of both my four year old and the PSU...and now I cant seem to find it. That and the fact that the power supply was probabely the only thing I never unplugged from the motherboard before now. After my recent education on PSUs though, I am now doubting whether or not that one would have worked now anyway. I think I was mostly checking the voltage and the fact that there were enough plugs including the one for the floppy. I do have some good news though... The PSU in this Dell does have the power cables labeled P1-P6 or 7 aaaand it has a power connector (labeled P4) just like the one I need. This I did not understand , so the other good news is that I went back to the library and checked out the repairing PCs book again so I can read up some more on power supplies. I havent had time to read too much yet but I did notice in the book that when it was talking about AT style PSUs they seemed to be labeled with higher numbers eg. P10, P11, P12 instead of starting at P1 like this Dell. If this sounds like just more of my wishful thinking that it'll work...please dont hesitate to tell me, lol. Oh and the Dell PSU is 250w which is the same wattage as the dead one! This might be a good time to tell you that according to the motherboard manual the P5SS-Me is a micro-ATX board who's format features blah blah blah, and smaller power consumption. So what do ya think?

OK, Well since no ones told me what they think....guess I will just have to think for myself huh Bassman? Sorry I wasted so much of everyones time on that power supply compatability issue...I just wanted one to work soooo badly! I hope it makes you all feel better though to know that I learned a lot from you guys and you know what they say, knowledge is power! In this case especially, lol. OK, Well I am signing off to rob this computer of a power suppy now, so wish me luck ! Thanks again everyone http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

Hi Crystal.
Sorry I didn't pick up on your last post sooner. I forgot to set tracking.
As for the numbering on the connectors, not sure what to tell you there. I have never seen anything other than P8/P9 and ATX.
Again, if the connectors work and the wattage is similar, you could use this other PSU to test whether or not that is your problem. If it is, 250W. ATX style PSUs are faily inexpensive and as you can see somewhat easy to change (no software, no config....) "Recommendation"??? Take the old one with you to match size, connectors, number of connectors, etc...
Good luck

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If I tell you to think for yourself, then you're not doing it.
.
.
This is not directed at those asking questions in order to gain knowledge. That shows you are thinking.

[This message has been edited by bassman (edited 09-25-2001).]