Hello all, I have a few questions and since this forum so admirably helped me build my new system, I figured i'd come back for more advice.

Here's the low-down. I purchased a tvix about a month ago (http://www.tvixusa.com/default.asp?id=61&mnu=51) I have a 250 gb hard drive in there currently. the thing is great, only problem is I already need more space as I have an extensive DVD library i'm backing up onto my Tvix. Now the Tvix only supports one hard drive via IDE, and it does not allow the use of any external hard drive. Now on one board I came across someone claimed to have used an "ide splitter" and has the ide splitter connected to seperate hard drives. Now I don't mean to ramble, so here's my first question. Is there such a thing that you can "split" an IDE cable with some sort of adaptor to send it to 2 or more hard drives?

Secondly, if thre is such a thing, do you think that going with some sort of hard drive rack/tray/drawer thingie would be a good idea, something like this
https://www.startech.com/ststore/ItemDetail.cfm?ProductID=DRW110ATABK&tab=a&mt=a . My concern with this method is the power. in the Tvix, there is one IDE connection and one molex connector for power. is it possible to split the molex to power a secondary device? Ok, i'll stop the inquisition for now, Please, and thoughts are greatly appreciated as I seem to have hit a dead end.

Thanks in advance,
Brian

Why not just replace the existing 250 GB HD when it gets filled up with another unused HD?

Because I am looking to add more storage without having to swap in more hard drives, or at least an easier way of doing that. which is where the drawer idea came from. At least with the drawers I can keep another hard drive in a tray, and it makes swapping them out easier. I did come across a Drawer system that holds 3 HD's at the same time, but each requires their own ide and power. Somehow I don't think that splitting the ide and power 3x is such a good idea. Plus the item is only for sata so far. In case i do decide to go with the multi drawer idea, does and ide/power splitter exist?

Molex adapters that allow a 1-to-2 split are available for a few $.
The question is will the power supply in the TVIX have sufficient capacity to handle more than 1 HD.

Also, IDE cables are available with 2 HD connectors(these are normally supplied as standard with most retail computers and HD's).
However, they are usually restricted to a max length of 18" in order to prevent data loss, which may not be long enough for your game plan. However, I've heard of 24" IDE cables that have been used successfully.

OK, i follow with the molex connectors. but about ide cables. There is one ide connected inside the tvix, and one end to go to the hard drive that goes in the tvix. Is it possible to use a standard ide cable with 3 connectors (motherboard, master, slave) and connect it to the one comming out of the tvix? I guess what i mean is, is the connection to the motherboard the same as the connection fron the cable to the hard drive, cause if that is the case than just using one standard ide cable i can connect 2 hard drives if i get a power connector. Am i saying this right?

One important question to be answered before proceeding with anything else -> Is the IDE terminal on the TVIX the same as a standard IDE terminal on a MB?

If not, then you will need an adapter to convert it so that a standard IDE cable can be connected to the TVIX.

If the TVIX terminal is the same as a MB terminal, then you obviously will not need an adapter, but you will have to replace the existing 2 connector IDE cable in the TVIX with a 3 connector cable, since the end connectors on an IDE cable are female, while the terminals on a MB, a HD, and possibly the TVIX are male.

However, this still does not answer the question as to whether the length between the Slave and Master connectors on a standard IDE cable will enable it to extend far enough out of the TVIX in order for you to connect an external HD.

Ok Ski, I took a look at my tvix yesterday, and the ide connection comming out of the tvix is like a standard female connector to hook up a hard drive. SO my question to you is, does an adaptor exist to change this to a male connector so that i can hook up another ide cable with 2 female connections.

I found a webpage with images of someone who did the same conversion i'm looking at. you'll need to translate the page from japaneese to english, here is the link to the japanese site, the images are pretty self explanitory. http://www.oklab.com/tvix/ .

Now, looking at his pictures, he just wanted to be able to swap out drives more easily and make them portable. I would most likely use a large velcro pad to put together the hard drive rack and the tvix, then add the rubber feet so that the cables can connect underneath. But what i was thinking is if there is some sort of adaptor i can still put a primary drive in the tvix and then use the rack for a secondary drive at the same time. Any thoughts?

Male-to-male 40 pin IDE adapters appear to be a rare breed.

Here's 2 that I was able to find. The 1st one may require a pair of tin snips to free the IDE adapter:

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:9ZORW540DxUJ:shop.store.yahoo.com/cablesonline/3bayide40pin.html+ide+%2240+pin+male%22+adapter&hl=en

http://www.stonewallcable.com/product.asp?dept%5Fid=122&pf%5Fid=IDEMM+++++++++++++++

Cool, that second one seems to fit the bill the best, unfortunately its also more expensive. I was able to find this http://www.isellsurplus.com/product.asp?id=9910&c=5&s=38 the only problem i see with this is where do I put the bracket? I guess it'd be ok to leave it dangle out the bottom, but I hesitate to do that. Do you think that my Tvix would be able to power 2 hard drives(one in the rack w/fan) ok? here is a link to the pdf with the tvix specs. http://demod.dvico.com/Manual/TViX/TViX_Eng.pdf It uses a standard ac plug to power it, so i'm thinking it'll be alright but i'd be interested in your thoughts. This is the rack I was thinking of getting http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-122-107&depa=0

Since there's no specs on the PS's wattage capacity in the manual, I cannot say whether or not it will be able to power 2 HD's.
If the PS has a spec label on it that can be accessed, then that may tell us something.

This thing has USB2, why not just buy a USB2 external drive and back up to that?

I would, but you can't use usb and the video cables at the same time. Trust me I wish it were that easy :)

Maybe I should read up on this thing a bit, but I AM kinda lazy :D ;)
How do you control or function this device? Via the onboard buttons/remote and view on your TV screen? Or do you go thru a computer? I guess my first concern is, if you were to add a second HDD, how would you format it? How would you direct it to backup to other drive
In following along with some of the above, although you could easily plug a dual HDD ribbon cable in and therefore connect 2 HDD's, does this machine have the capability of differentiating between 2 seperate drives and assigning them names/priority, or does it simply increase it's capacity?
From the site you posted it seems clear it can be connected, but what final outcome/capabilities do you achieve?

lol, i'm pretty lazy too so i'll do the legwork for ya! :P
Ok, the device functions as an external hard drive when connected via USB to the PC. So, formatting is quite easy just using windows. From what I've been able to gather, Tvix is able to recognize multiple HD's and they list then on the left side of the user interface on the TV. When connected to the TV (no tv connection and usb at the same time unfortunately) its controlled by a remote and a folder like user interface. Here is a link to a french forum with screenshots of the UI http://forum.surdvd.com/viewtopic.php?p=163201#163201

I suppose the final outcome i'm looking for is the ability to have as much readily available drive space as possible, with the ability to have some easy way to swap in another drive without having to dismantle the tvix. SO my thinking with the rack/drawer system was to use one HD in the Tvix, one HD in the rack, and then just get another drawer to keep another HD in once i've filled up the first 2.

OK, well, how about this. On a standard IDE ribbon cable, you have three connectors, one on either end and one near one end. Since these cables are omni-directional, you could open your case unplug the existing cable, plug the new cable using the end closest to the mid section connector, use the mid section connector for the internal drive, then the other end should hang out of the case with plenty of length for the swapable drive.

Keep us updated as I am becoming interested in this thing;)

You piqued my curiousity with your endeavor! I've been doing some searching and it appears that Bassman's solution in combination with ski's is exactly what the Japanese fellow produced.

From the picture: http://www.oklab.com/tvix/images/011.jpgit appears that the IDE cable was indeed replaced with a standard IDE 2 drive connector. It also appears that he has tapped into the Tvix power supply...Hmmmmm....you might want to check with your manual and see what the power output actually is for the unit...I suspect that it might be marginal.

The Tvix probably used a standard IDE chipset controller...why reinvent the wheel. If the Japanese unit is actually cranking, it probably does support 2 IDE devices. The problem is, that's as many devices as an IDE chipset currently can handle.

It doesn't appear that there's anything out there that would allow you to convert from an IDE connection to some sort of daisy-chainable devices to enable adding multiple harddrives...although, it does appear that he's using a swappable IDE bay as you are aware...

Ok, I posted on the Tvix forum about what the specs are on the power supply so hopefully i'll get some sort of answer soon. Whyzman, i'm having the same thoughts on the ability to use 2 IDE devices, i'm sure that there wouldn't be a site with pictures outlining how to do it if it wasn't going to work. It does concern me that the person is only using the rack system as his primary hard drive which could mean that the PS is only capable of doing one or the other.

This leads me to another thought that I had. I recently saw this http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?cid=48418&PAGE=PRODUCT&PROD_ID=831353&fp=F# Now I think to do this I would need to still replace the existing IDE cable, and then use the 40 pin male ide adaptor that Ski found and then connect it to this ide-usb dongle, but that way I might be able to use an external HD with its own power. Now this is a messy way of doing it but its the only alternative i've come up with.

In the mean time, I appreciate everyone's help, and I'll keep you updated. So as soon as I fill up my 200, i'll be giving one of these methods a shot.

~Brian

I didn't translate the Japanese link you provided. If he's using the rackmount as his primary drive without changing to a standard IDE 2 connector cable that would make sense also. That way he's not taxing the power supply...

Have you been able to check how the supplied IDE cable is connected to the board inside? If it's a standard IDE block connector you could consider replacing with one of the newer round IDE cables for ease of positioning.

I think the adapter you've linked is using USB technology to adapt to the IDE...not the other way around...don't know if it would work.

The best i can figure, the connection to the board is a standard IDE block connector, I had thought of using the round cables as well, they are just so much easier to work with. I hadn't realized about the usb-ide adaptor, but like I said its kinda a last resort anyway. Here is a link to a series of pictures that show someone disassembling the tvix http://tvix.site.voila.fr/ there is a shot somewhere in there of the ide connection. In your opinion, what would be a minimum of power required to run the 2 HD's and the rack fan?

Here's one possible concept:

http://www.baber.com/cases/drive_enclosures/bex_hd_2b.htm

I used a similar setup for a SCSI enclosure I have setup for storage. As ski pointed out earlier, there are length restrictions with IDEs. This enclosure idea would be practical depending on the ability of the tvix to handle to IDE drives. Of course, it might just be handy to have another drive housed in it even it you could only use one drive at a time. For me, I just like the neatness of this possible setup. The tvix would be able to be positioned next to the IDE storage.

I don't remember off-hand what they are called, but for the SCSI enclosure there was a connector/junction that fits into the rear of the case to facilitate the SCSI cable's transfer from outside to inside the case. Of course with the SCSI, it has a nice screw down feature so the cable's don't easily come disconnected. There might be something similar for the IDE cable...or, I would hope so, as the IDEs don't seem to stay put sometimes.

There's a link also on the page I have above to the swappable drives... I wasn't looking for price, only use...

Also, as you can see, this unit comes with its own 80W power supply and cooling fan.

________________

It looks like 24" is the limit for IDE cables. I would consider one of these in a lesser length, due to its shielding, from the tvix to the storage enclosure. If a passthrough connector/junction is available, I would then consider a short 3 connect IDE to attach to each of the drive bays. Of course, that's if the tvix chipset supports more than one drive...

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=12-103-303&depa=0

My question with this, is how would I connect it to the Tvix? I don't see any IDE connections on the back of it. I like that it has its own power source, and has space for 2 drives, but I need some way to connect it to the tvix. I could totally see this just sitting next to the tvix though in a nice neat package.

That's where I was going with the IDE cable to the back of the storage. If you're within the 24" limit for IDE cables you could use a short one from the tvix to the storage. I'm looking for a connector to transfer from the outside of the storage to the inside using IDE...then, a short 3 connect to the connector/junction on the back of the storage to the IDE drives in the storage.

Worst case, would be to have a round IDE cable from the tvix directly into the storage...just cut a whole in the back of the storage and pass through...or, remove one of the plates on the back and just pass it through...

I'm looking for a modular plate IDE connector...they fasten to the back of the storage just like to a standard computer case. Most often we see them as a 2 USB plate connector for adding additional USB ports....

Well, research tells me that you can go up to 36" with an IDE...

No internal-to-external IDE L-bracket exists (that I can find anyway) that would facilitate IDE transfer from the outside to the inside of the storage box. Although, a round cable would work well also passing through a removed L-bracket blank on the rear of the case...

Big question is still, "Will the tvix support 2 IDE devices?"

Ok, I got a response back from Tvix, and here are the PS Specs. About 26W (12V 1.5A/5V 2A ). So can someone translate that for the electrically illiterate?

It looks as though the power supply is similar to most computer power supply units in that it is capable of pumping out different voltages i.e., 12V and 5V.

It appears as though the numbers don't even come out correctly.

Watts=Volts X Amps

12V rail: 12v X 1.5a=18Watts
5V rail: 5v X 2a =10Watts
28Watts

http://www.pcworld.com/resource/zoom.asp

You might want to take a look at the 250 Harddrive you have in your tvix and see what the power requirements are. They should be listed on the drive itself....hopefully!

I've seen anything from the link above 5-15W to 25W for a harddrive. Whatever the actual numbers for individual harddrives, you've only 18W on the 12V rail to power both the harddrive and if there's a fan that would more than likely be on the 12V rail also.

Also, 18W is peak power on the 12V rail which would be taxing the power supply. Continuous power demand would hopefully be less!

In my humble opinion, there's nothing left in this bad boy to power a second drive, much less a second drive and fan...

Man that really sux! So unless I were to go with something with its own power supply, then i'm kinda up the perverbial creek without a paddle then? Hmmm, is there any way to power a rack like i have been looking at by getting some sort of Molex - AC power converter? does such a thing actually exist?

The double bay box I linked earlier has an 80W power supply which would be enough to run a couple of harddrives and the cooling fan...

This are set up to use either SCSI drives or IDE drives so they have the necessary molex connectors for everything you need....

I opened up the tvix and unfourtunatly the ide cable is stuck to the board and cant be replaced, but here is something that can be done nice and clean. get this hdd box (http://www.baber.com/cases/drive_enclosures/bex_hd_2b.htm) it has an open bracket slot on the back. then you can use this bracket (http://www.isellsurplus.com/product.asp?id=9910&c=5&s=38). as long as you put the hdd box right next to the tvix, it's internal ide cable should be long enough to reach the hdd box. This way you have the 2 drives on one port and each drive will have power from the hdd box, and withought a hard drive inside the tvix you can disconnect the tvix fan which i've heard alot of complaints about. i am going to order the parts soon and if no one has replied that this works or not before i try, i'll let yall know.

I'm curious about the whether or not the IDE connector is being controlled by a chipset. How will the motherboard be able to distinguish between the Master and Slave positions for storage and recall??

Also, the IDE adapter has a 40 wire connect. I would think the new mammoth harddrives will probably have 80 wire connects.

I dont recall where but somewhere I read that someone had already hooked up 2 hard drives and it read fine (hdd1 hdd2. same as having 2 partition hdd). It is likely to assume that when tvix built there unit they used a standard ide chips to read the drives rather than build a new one and i have never seen an ide that couldnt read master slave. If you try it i would make it easy on the unit and set jumpers on drives to master/slave rather than cable select. I have 300 gb hard drive filled with 210gb. when it is full I'll but my theroy into practice and let you know if it works.

It is kind of hard to belive that as long as this thread has been running no one has tried it yet.

Hi guys, I've got a similar sort of problem but its with a DTH7000 Thomson hard disk recorder instead of a TVIX. Ive got software which allows me to import recordings to my pc, demux and remux them to clean them up and then i use dvd shrink to burn to dvd. All works fine. However it does involve having to remove the DTH's disk and install it into the pc everytime i transfer vid files. What i want to do is run a usb cable from my pc to an external usb hard disk enclosure local to the DTH. Have the DTH's hard disk in the enclosure. So far no problem i think. But i have to plug in the IDE from the recorder to the hard disk aswell.Now i got a problem. You see, i want to get away from moving the hard disk every time i transfer files. But i dont know if the recorder,it's hard disk and the pc can all be connected together this way. or would i need some sort of IDE splitter like you all discussed above?? Any thoughts?? Be nice to me i'm a bit of a newbie!!!!!!!!!

Reading back through the thread to familiarize myself with what's been going on it appears that you're facing the same problems. Whatever motherboard they are using in these devices does not have USB capabilities, only IDE, and that appears to be the bottleneck.

The poster above you said he might try a Master/Slave scenario on the IDE and see what would happen. You might want to email or PM if it is available and he see how he fared...

Welcome to the forums! Be nice to me i'm a bit of a newbie!!!!!!!!! It's great to be able to point out to people visiting us that the folks who hang out here always treat guests with respect regardless of their level of computer savvy! We offer a safe environment to learn! ;)

Hi Jinova1 i itried what you said about hooking up two hard drives but it was on my hard disc recorder. it only saw the slave drive and not the master. so i swapped master to slave and the slave to master and it only saw the slave again. WIERD. and then i phsically swapped them round on the cable and swapped the master slave jumper and again both times it only saw the slave. then i tried cable select and it didnt like that atall it just came up with a strange error on the screen!