Monitor Blacks out, need expert help

[exnihilo]

Hi I need some help with a problem which I think is related to video but not entirely sure. What happens is that my monitor is constantly going black. It does it any time it wants and for however long it wants. Sometimes it goes black for 1 second other times 30 mins, I can't seem to see any pattern in it.

What I do know is that the problem is not my monitor, my video card or my video card drivers. I know this because I have tried changing monitors. My monitor worked perfectly on my friends machine but his monitor started doing the black thing on my machine. I have swapped my video card for a different one and the problem still occured. And I have updated to the latest video card drivers(which was what I already had when the probelm started).

I have taken my machine to a computer expert but when he started it up it worked perfectly and made me look like an idiot, so then I took it home and it started doing the black thing again. I figured that maybe there might be something loose in some hardware somewhere and that it fell into place when I took it to the expert but then fell out of place on the way back, I don't know just a theory.

The green light on my monitor stays on even when it goes black. It has nothing to do with heat as far as I can tell. My system is running at 35 degrees C and all the fans are working. Before this problem started the fan in my power supply box had stopped starting by itself, I had to flick it to get it started. So I thought that might be why the screen started going black. Midway through the problem I replaced the power supply with brand new one, but the problem did not go away. I have checked all the cables and expansion slots to make sure everything is pushed in correctly, but they were and the problem still occured.

I can't for the life of me fathom what is wrong with my computer. Through the process of elimination (by replacing parts) I think I have narrowed it down to the mainboard and the CPU. One more thing which may be interesting to know is that sometimes, usually after my computer goes into a 30min black period and I reset it, the mainboard does not start up. The diagnostic LED's on the mainboard light as (red,red,red,green), according to my mainboard book three red and one green means it is "Initializing Video Interface. This will start detecting CPU clock, checking type of video onboard. Then detect and initialize the video adapter." it usually sits at that point for anything from three seconds to an hour, and then continues with starting up. And another thing, when the screen goes black it just fades away really quickly, there are no changes within the monitor such as clicks or the resolution changing sound. And early on when the problem first started the screen would sometime goes haywire, the image would flicker and ripple before it went black. But that does not happen anymore.

I have played with all my display control panels to no end. I turn hardware acceleration off, went into safe mode, lowered my resolution, turned off all power management and even underclocked my videocard, but nothing worked.

It has taken me nearly a week to write this post because of the screen going black. I really hope somehere can help me. I am prepared to buy another motherboard or CPU if it is broken, but how can I be sure it is, I don't want to end up buying a whole new motherboard when the problem could be fixed. Any help whatsoever will be greatly appreciated. My computer's stats,

Pentium 3 450 mhz
Atx Bx13 Mainboard
128MB ram
Voodoo 3 3000 Video card
Running under Windows 2000
Monitor is ADI Microscan .26dot pitch

[bassvax]

My guess is that the port on the mobo where your monitor connects is loose and/or faulty. If any component connections are loose this causes the boot process to fail or take too long. Any other problems? I don't know that the system power supply would have anything to do with this or not...I don't think it would. Have you disabled power management in the BIOS as well as the control panel? I understand the problem persists in safe-mode as well?

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Jerry

[mjc]

You didn't say if it was a PCI or AGP video card if it is a PCI try it in a different slot, if it is an AGP borrow a PCI card, because there is on 1 AGP slot. I agree sounds like it could be a bad slot.

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mjc
I'm making my own links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

[exnihilo]

The video card is agp, and I checked the all the connections(to make sure they weren't loose), even swapped my video card for a matrox(agp) to see if it was the voodoo causing the problem but the black out still occurs. I have also disabled power management in the bios aswell but that didn't fix it. And yes it still does it in safe mode. I think you might be onto something with the faulty agp slot theory though. That would explain why it still went black with the Matrox video card. Unfortunately I don't have a pci videocard to test this, but if my agp slot is faulty is there anyway I can confirm it before I buy a whole new motherboard?

[Randy_tx]

If it didnt do the blackout thing at the computer dealer's place, the only difference was it was HIS MONITOR. See if you can borrow someone's MONITOR to try it for a few hours......You might have a defective MONITOR http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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"As hard as a rock & dumb as a brick"...Windows CEMeNT

[mjc]

Borderline line solderr joints are very difficult to see, somettimes a marginal solder joint will take a while to show up and it could eveen be intermitant. Normal use will eventually cause a marginal joint to fail, so I would try to borrow a PCI card to try, it doesn't have to be a fast one (4MB or 8MB should work) this is just for testing, if it works then most likely it is the slot (Tried different cards and different monitors).



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mjc
I'm making my own links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

[Randy_tx]

I see that now! Gad......what a mystery http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif

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"As hard as a rock & dumb as a brick"...Windows CEMeNT

[exnihilo]

Guys I tried using a pci video card to see if my agp port was faulty but it still went black, so I don't think it is a faulty agp port. But I have discovered something new. When my screen goes black my computer actually stops working. What ever sound is playing at the time starts recurring constantly and the computer effectively locks up. When the blackness goes the computer continues on from where it left off. Could this be the cpu playing up?

[mjc]

Have you tried turning off power management?

Control Panel-> Power Management set it to always on, never ,never.

Also make sure any screen savers are disabled (including Screen Scan if you have McAfee anti-virus).

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mjc
I'm making my own links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

[exnihilo]

Yes all power management is off. I even turned off APM advanced power management support just for the hell of it. But its still going black. I'm curious to know whether the cpu has anything to do with it. Like I said before the computer is essentially locking up when the screen goes black, could it be that my cpu is faulty? Should I take this problem to the System troubleshooter forum?

[mjc]

I'm beginning to wonder if it may be a power problem, try plugging the machine into a different outlet, on a different circuit, if your panel box isn't well marked then you need to resort to the lamp trick (plug a lamp into the outlet and turn off the breakers or pull fuses on at a time until you find the right one). Then plug the machine into another outlet not on that circuit. Also what is the rating on the power suoply for your computer?

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mjc
I'm making my own links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

[sleddog]

Originally posted by exnihilo:
Guys I tried using a pci video card to see if my agp port was faulty but it still went black, so I don't think it is a faulty agp port. But I have discovered something new. When my screen goes black my computer actually stops working. What ever sound is playing at the time starts recurring constantly and the computer effectively locks up. When the blackness goes the computer continues on from where it left off. Could this be the cpu playing up?

Sounds like a conflict between your sound card and video card (or something else). Try removing the sound card driver and let Windows re-install it. Or try the system with the sound card driver removed and the sound card physically out of the machine.

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sleddog
[sleddog.f2s.com] (http://www.sleddog.f2s.com)

[BigBlue66]

Hi,

I absolutely agree with Sled. There has to be a conflict somewhere. Do you have yellow splats in Device Manager beside either the vid card or sound card?

Have you checked Resources for each to see if there is a conflict? Do you have onboard sound? Have you checked IRQ usage under Computer in Device Manager?

Since you have already tried a different one, I don't think it's the MONITOR, as Randy so hesitantly pointed out. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Just pickin on ya Rand.

And, probably the only reason it worked right at the computer dealer was that the problem just didn't decide to surface right then. Given more time, it most likely would have.

Do as Sleddog suggested. But, first find out if there are indeed conflicts between the sound and video. You may have to force one or the other to use a different IRQ, if there is one available.

Post back with any progress. You have my curiosity peaked now. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Cheers,

Big Blue 66

[exnihilo]

Sorry about taking so long to reply but the blacking of the screen makes it hard to reply quickly.

For mjc, This is whats written on the power supply box,

250W Power Supply
In 115/230v ~ 6/4A 60/50Hz.

I don't know if this is what your looking for. I tried switching to another circuit in the house but it didn't fix the problem either.


I've checked to make sure there are no resource conflicts on either the sound card or video card and the computer says that all my devices are working properly. But just in case I uninstalled the sound card drivers and physically removed the sound card, but that didn't work either.

I don't know if I said before but this blacking out thing actually occurs in dos mode and in the bios menu as well as windows. So I though that would automatically cancel out it being a software problem.

I have also borrowed another cpu to swap for mine to see if it was the cpu. But once again the problem still occurs.

So far I have replaced and in theory determined what is not causing the problem the following things,

-the video card(including a pci one)
-the cpu (swapped my 450 for a 550)
-the monitor
-removed the sound card

As far as I can tell this only leaves the motherboard. I'm on the verge of buying a new motherboard because this problem has gone on for too long. Does anyone think that there is a high percentage chance that it isn't the motherboard? I figured that because it is effectively locking up when the screen goes black that it would be related to the cpu, but after replacing that and still having the problem it should be the motherboard right. I can't see any physical damage to the motherboard. What I can see though is like I said before, the computer hangs at the boot process. And the diagnostic LED's on the mainboard light as (red,red,red,green), and according to my mainboard book three red and one green means it is,

"Initializing Video Interface. This will start detecting CPU clock, checking type of video onboard. Then detect and initialize the video adapter."

This is straight from my Motherboard Book, but what exactly does it mean. Before this problem started it never did this(hang at the boot process). I believe this is the key to identifing this problem. Any more suggestions in light of this new stuff?

and thanks for your continued help guys.

[mjc]

I was thinking maybe a power problem because when you had to the shop it didn't act up, and the power source was a difference, a 250W PS should be enough.

But, before you buy a new MOBO try loading the default BIOS routines. Usually by entering setup and loading the power on and/or CMOS default then saving, you can also try running with the MOBO removed from the case, unscrew it and leave the wires attached (either put it on a table with room for the MOBO to sit outside the case or put several layers of newspaper under the MOBO and leave in the case but not screwed down), don't worry if the harddrive isn't connected, all you want to do is get it to POST and then enter setup. (So the minimum you need is power, video,mouse, keyboard). If it successfully does that then you can try with the HD and see if you can get into Windows, if so let run a while and see if the video acts up. If it doesn't then get some washers (cardboard will do) and put them between the mounting posts and the MOBO.



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mjc
I'm making my own links list:Computer Links (http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/highrise/11/index.htm)

[rockymtnsage]

I may have the solution to your problem. I had the same thing happen to me on a couple different systems, my own included. In both cases it was a corrupted video driver. Find the driver for your video card (may as well search the net for a new one while you're at it) and install it. I know it sounds bizarre, but I recognized your symptoms right away. The ones I saw were even more strange, because there were additional problems. Good luck.

[Paleo Pete]

rocky may have a good idea... Remove the video card from Device Manager in Safe Mode, and reboot, let Windows find and reinstall it. The only thing I question about that is the fact that it still does the same thing in BIOS. At that point, the video driver shouldn't be loaded yet, only the video BIOS that's stored on a chip on the card. So it sounds like a hardware problem somewhere rather than driver or software. I think it's a remote possibility, but it might be worth a try.

Have you reseated the memory? Bad connection there might be at least part of the problem. Can you replace the cable going from video card to monitor? Some are removable, most are not.

If possible try another power supply, 300W or higher. That might be it. 250W could be too weak for the system, if you have more than the basic setup, one hard drive, floppy and CD ROM. I'd actually think that would be the most likely solution.

I can't think of anything else, this one's been puzzling me for days and I haven't posted until now because I didn't have any ideas that hadn't already been posted.

Besides, I'm not an expert. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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[exnihilo]

The problem still isn't fixed http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif At this point I have removed or replaced every part of my computer except the motherboard and nothing seems to effect it, it is still totally random. And it still occurs just the same in dos and the bios menu. When in a game it seems to lock up, in other words no game data goes through, but in windows OS it just goes black but you can still do stuff just can't see anything. This would kinda make it a videocard problem I figured, but once again replacing the video card even with a pci one didn't fix the problem.

But I think you might be onto something with the power supply idea. I do have two cd rom drives and the voodoo 3 does get hot even when I'm just in a normal OS and not in a game. Perhaps there is a problem with the power flow to the videocard, or just generally around the whole system. I'm gonna see if a 300w power supply might fix it. If it doesn't perhaps I better just buy another motherboard. I figure its a hardware problem and I have replaced every piece of hardware except the motherboard so it's gotta be it right? I'll get back to you on any developments. It could be a while though because the problem makes it hard to use the computer, sometimes a whole day is wasted because it feels like going black for hours!

[Paleo Pete]

Hot video card throws another possibility into the picture...try running it with the case open and a small fan blowing inside, see if that makes a difference. If so, it's a heat problem.

Am I wrong or have I seen similar heat problems here with the same video card? And does anyone know if this is one of the video cards that you can add a heatsink to? If so that might be a good thing...

Hold off on the power supply, that may not be the problem after all. Try to find out if it's heat first.

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Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!
Note: Please post your questions on the forums, not in my email.

Computer Information Links (http://www.geocities.com/paleopete/)

[mjc]

Just about any vid card can have a heat sink added, some are just easier than others and small heatsink is better than none. You can try adding a small one with thermal tape (can be had at Radio Shack hs and tape). If that helps you can try hereThe Heatsink Guide: Video Card Cooling Info (http://www.heatsink-guide.com/).


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mjc
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