what are acceptable voltage and temp ranges?

[mas]

Can anyone tell me how to find out what the correct range is for temperature and voltage?

My new computer seems to have something wrong with its voltage *and* it gets hot. It's a P4, 1.6MHz with a 300W FCC/UL approved power supply in a medium-tower ATX case, running Win98SE. I bought the prefabricated system from Computer Surplus Outlet (www.computersurplusoutlet.com).

I checked temperature and voltage using the BIOS setup and two freeware programs. The problem with the BIOS readings is that they're just readings and I don't know if they're in the correct range. When I ran the programs (MBProbe, web.bham.ac.uk/jst829/mbprobe, and Hmonitor, www.hmonitor.com), alarms flashed for some of the readings, but neither program provides much information on what the readings mean.

How do I find out what the correct readings should be? The Intel P4 datasheet and other Intel documents aren't helpful to someone who's not an electrical engineer (like me!). I'm especially concerned about the voltage readings; whether the temperature is within the accepted range or not, I already know that I want to lower it to extend the computer's life. And install different fans to decrease the noise.

Here are the BIOS readings (the computer had been running approximately 20 minutes in an ambient temperature of 72 degrees F):
Vcore = 1.728V
Vcc2.5V = 2.480V
Vcc3.3V = -3.280V
12V = 12.416V
-12V = 11.967V
SB5V = 4.919V
VBAT = 3.344V
System fan speed = 0 RPM (However, I see 3 fans inside the case: one in the power supply, one on the motherboard (on the chips? on the CPU? I'm not sure of the terminology), and one venting the whole case)
CPU fan speed = 6026 RPM
Power temperature = 43 degrees C/109 degrees F
System temperature = 32C/89F
CPU temperature = 32C/91F

MBProbe readings that flash red are:
Vccp2 = 2.48V
-5V = 3.49V
-12V = -3.78

Hmonitor readings displayed in red are:
CoreV = +1.74V (although MBProbe's Vccp1 = 1.74V is not flashing red)
Aux V = +2.24V (I'd guess Aux V is what MBProbe calls Vccp2)
Hmonitor's display for -5V and -12V is not enabled, so I can't compare them with MBProbe's readings.

Temperature readings in MBProbe and Hmonitor aren't displayed in red, even though they're close to the BIOS readings. An irritation is that I can't correlate one program's reading with another because they all---BIOS, MBProbe, and Hmonitor---seem to use different terminology for the names of components.
Thanks in advance for any help you can give me.
Maryann

[gwallen4]

Maryann -

If your system is running okay, no unexpected reboots or crashes, then your voltages are probably fine. If you are having problems, please describe what they are. I would trust bios readings over other programs. The bios was set up for your particular motherboard.

The CPU temp is nice and cool.

Computers with fast processors do seem hot. They produce alot more heat than the older slower CPU's.

[mas]

What a relief! No, I haven't had any problems at all so far. I've had the system about 3 weeks. This whole brouhaha started when I looked into ways to quiet the system. When I put it in a cardboard box (I go for the low-tech solutions first), the temperature climbed. I downloaded MBProbe so I could keep a eye on the temperature, then got excited when MBProbe flashed red lights and beeped at me.
So I'll calm down about the voltages but still look for ways to cool the system. There's lots of information about cooling on the Internet. I just have to sort through it and decide what I want to do.
Thanks for your quick reply.
Maryann

[gwallen4]

Glad you're not having problems. A good source for info about cooling solutions, quiet fans, etc. can be found at overclockers.com. These guys go to extraordinary lengths to produce more heat (by overclocking) and trying to get rid of it.

http://www.overclockersonline.com/?page=articles

I like to put my computers under the desk. This takes the noise level down to acceptable levels for me. You can buy quieter fans, or even try unplugging a case fan and see what happens to cpu temp. I'm not sure where a P4 is supposed to be but 32C. sounds like you have some leeway. Don't turn off your CPU fan!

Finally, even if you shorten the life of your components, there is little chance they will fail before becoming totally obsolete.

[Whyzman]

Maryann,

I would agree that your temps are well within acceptable range. By putting the unit into a cardboard box, however, the ability for the air movement to dissipate the heat away from the case would become an issue.

There are probably quieter fans available, however, removing the factory fan might void your warranty. Indeed, one of the downsides to purchasing pre-built vs. assembling the parts yourself. :(

As far as the voltages, probably mjc would have that answer. I cannot remember what the acceptable +/- percentages are...definitely a sign of my personal HD drive slipping! :D

You might want to ask the manufacturer if it would affect your warranty if you substituted for any of the stock fans. What brand of fan is on the processor (model #)? Also, the other fans, what brand/model#s?

If they agree to any swapping...be sure to get it in writing!

[mjc]

I would stick in the ± 5% range, but seeing as some of your voltages are so radically different in MBprobe I would say that it is not properly detecting the monitoring chip. And as for the fan speed, the software may not be correctly set to monitor your fans, or your fans may not have speed sensors (cheap noisy fans probably don't).

[mas]

Thanks for the reassurance, mjc. It looks like my voltages, as detected by the BIOS, are within that +/-5% range. I'll go back to working on quieting the fans.
The CPU fan is the only one whose label I can see. It says it's a Galaxy, made in China. The power supply fan's label is on the case side, so I can read only what letters show through the grill. I can't tell who the manufacturer is, but I can see it says "sleeve bearing," which I now know means cheap. But the fan is *within* the power supply case. Does that mean I'd have to replace the entire power supply to replace the fan?
Whyzman, excellent advice about probably voiding the warranty. I wouldn't have thought of that until too late! I'll send them a note and see what they say.
I think my best bet, warranty-wise and ease-of-modification-wise, is to replace the case fan. It's easy to get at and I could swap it out for the old fan if I ever had to send it back to the manufacturer. While rummaging around inside the case yesterday, I saw a place to install another fan, on the front of the case. So I have one more option for an easy modification.
I will also rearrange my set up and shove that noisy thing under my desk. Thanks for that thought, Sandman.
Whew! After all this, maybe I'll be ready to try building my own next time.
Maryann

[mjc]

You can replace a power supply fan, but usually it is more trouble than it is worth....because a power supply with a noisy fan is not usually a very high quality unit. So in the long run it usually just better to replace the entire thing thing with a high quality unit from Antec, Enermax (although there have been some problems noted with these in these forums), etc.

[Whyzman]

Maryann,

Adding more fans will not have a "dampening" effect on the noise level you're at already, in fact, it would just increase it! :(

There are fans, as mjc pointed out, that have thermal sensors which regulate the speed of the fan based on temperature. If the manufacturer allows a fan modification I would definitely advise going that direction with your choice.

There are also adapters (http://www.kdcomputers.com/eui/prime/profile/318/61/component.htm) (thanks Rick) which allow you to remove the power source from the Motherboard header and still be able to monitor.

And yes, now that you know the PC GUIDE FORUMS is here to help...building your own next go-round would be the way to go! ;)

[saphalline]

Originally posted by mas
I will also rearrange my set up and shove that noisy thing under my desk.

If it's on the floor, you might want to think about putting in some kind of case filter while you're in there. My main rig is on the floor and builds up dust like crazy! My mom's (which I built, too) is on top of a table and has never had dust problems. Filters are truly useful if you don't want to add your computer to your spring cleaning list. :p

[Whyzman]

saphalline,

Good point regarding the filters! ;)

I was trying to figure out what type of filter to use. While in the Micro Center a while back I picked up a couple of those plastic frame devices with the filter that are designed for the 80mm case fans...

I get home and pop the front panel of my Enlight case and the front fan is housed behind the pressed round bulge (I forgot) rendering the filters I purchased useless. I could mount them behind the fan, with some modifications to the plastic box the fan and speaker come mounted on...

However, I wanted to protect the fan blades from dust accumulation.

In Home Depot the other day I found what appears to be a great solution. Frost King polyurethane foam Air Conditioner Filter for about $3.00. It can be cut to any shape...is washable and re-usable. Although, why bother re-using when it's 24" X 15" in size.

I just cut a piece and duct-taped it over the opening...it's hidden by the front panel anyway. ;) Okay, I didn't actually duct-tape the thing over the opening...I duct-taped around the perimeter of the piece...allowing the air to flow through the filter...Sheesh! :rolleyes: