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[Deagle]

Hi, I have been looking for a 1700+ with JIUHB core and now that I ahve found it I'm so happy.:D Anyways, I will be using AS3 instead of the stock paste that comes with the SK-7. My question is that how should I spread the paste over the processor? Only on top of that square in the middle? Here's (http://www.angelfire.com/linux/techiezer0/1700jiuhb.gif) is a pic of it. Thanx:p

[Variable]

http://www.arcticsilver.com/arctic_silver_instructions.htm

[Whyzman]

I think Budfred uses the post-it notes to form a box on the heatsink in which to apply the AS...easily removed...

I use cellophane tape to form a box...

Using a single edge razor blade you would screed the artic silver flush with either of these methods and then remove the tape or post-it...

This leaves a near perfect layer on the heat sink...

As for the processor I also use a single edge and put a near paper thin coat on it...

I guess I should mention that when I'm doing this I have already lapped the heatsink to remove any cupping that naturally seems to occur when the aluminum is extruded...

Lapping: http://overclockersclub.com/heatsinklappingguide.php

[Budfred]

I agree with Variable, use the directions on their site. That said, I would use something like an old credit card to spread the compound on the little die in the middle and make sure it is paper thin. I use postit notes around the outside edges of the die to prevent bits of the compound getting on the rest of the chip. Other have talked about using things like tape, but I like postit notes because they come off easily and don't leave any residue.

Whyzman,

You got in before I finished my little bit...

I actually don't use anything on the heatsink, I smear it on and then wipe it off per AS instructions. The idea is just to fill in the pores. I use the postit notes on the chip die itself...

[Whyzman]

Budfred, glad you explained once again your procedure...

You are using them around the die itself...I like that...I was trying to figure out how that would exactly work on the sink itself...LOL

Ok, got it...

We're doing two separate parts...the die and the sink...each getting a coat using different techniques...

I kept trying to figure out how I would be able to screed the AS on the sink using the post-its....:rolleyes:

edit: Budfred, I'll have to take a closer look at the directions...I thought I remember applying the AS with the "baggie" thingy and then after you were to apply a thin layer in the center...that's why I was using the tape to get an exacting layer...

[Whyzman]

Or, this was a technique I picked up to avoid having to try getting an even layer on the die (which I recall having great trouble doing following numerous attempts)

The tape solved the problem for me...just putting a paper thin coat on the die and then building the cellophane tape box providing a uniform thickness...

Both appear to achieve their objectives...

I guess we'll leave this one to personal preference...I'm pleased that I'm no longer confused regarding your affinity to 3M...;)

Although, I do use Scotch Tape! :D

[Deagle]

Uh...confused:confused: Budfred, you make a box around the die? How do I do that? Also I was looking at umm AS3 instructions and got really confused again...:( Could someone explain it in simple terms or is that the simplest way to explain?(as in that wensite intructions)
Thanx:p

PS: Instructions #7 makes me confused since you put it on and then you wipe it off?:eek:

[Budfred]

The putting it on and wiping it off is what I was talking about that Whyzman and I do differently. You smear some AS on the heatsink and rub it in well with a plastic bag so that it fills all the microscopic holes and cracks in the surface of the heatsink. Then you wipe off the excess so that there is a residue left which you can see by a slight discoloration. DO NOT use alcohol or anything other than a lint free cloth/paper towel to wipe it off since you want to leave the residue. This helps to make a completely sealed contact when you actually put it on the CPU.

You make a box around the CPU die using the straight edge of the postit notes or tape, whichever you use. I use small postit notes since they cover pretty much the whole chip and are easier to handle than the big ones. You use 4 of them, one for each side around the die....

[Whyzman]

Sorry for the confusion! :(

It's all coming back to me now....LOL

When I was having difficulty putting a uniform layer of AS on the die I happened upon some instructions utilizing the cellophane tape "screed box" on the sink.

In my opinion, it was accomplishing the the same thing as trying to get the AS uniformly on the die, which I was having difficulty achieving.

Using Budfred's Post-it Note method it would be easier to get a film onto the die itself since you would not have to be concerned about getting the AS onto other parts of the chip.

For my purposes I'll use both methods now that I understand Budfred's use of the Post-its for putting a film on the die. I always found it difficult to get a uniform AS layer on the die without getting some elsewhere, not to mention just putting a "film" on the thing!

Although I always apply a "film" to the die its uniformity is not as critical when I'm using the "screed box" on the sink because I'm assured that the layer is exactly the cellphane tape thickness.

On the 900 AMD processor I first used the "screed box" method there seemed to be a slight roughness caused by the markings on the top of the die. This made it quite difficult to pull the razor across and try to elevate slightly above it and stay uniform.

[Budfred]

I can't imagine the calculations that it would take to find the exact sweet spot on the heatsink to put the layer of AS there. It would have to be precisely on the spot that is going to come down on the CPU die in order to work properly. That is part of the reason I like smearing a pretty good patch of it on the heatsink and then wipe it off... there isn't enough left to do any damage, but there is enough to cover the area of the CPU die....

[Whyzman]

there isn't enough left to do any damage

Am I in trouble?? :confused: :D

I don't aim to be machine shop precise...only to ensure that the "screed box" area is sufficient that the die will come into complete contact.

"Excess" outside where the die comes into contact would be inconsequential as the film is only the thickness of the cellophane tape and will not cause "damage." I would say that my "screed box" is approximately 1/8" reveal around the die itself.

[Deagle]

Hey um thanx for all the help so far but I'm still a little confuse. So with the post-it notes, I make a box around the die like this (http://www.angelfire.com/linux/techiezer0/1700jiuhb_repaint.gif)? Also can someone just simply those steps please so I can understand it more easily. Or just tell me how did you do your from start to finish.
Thanx again:p

[Budfred]

Well, if your CPU hasn't fried already, I doubt it will any time soon....:D I just find it easier to focus on the die and use the postit notes to prevent leakage. I am not sure I got it precisely right either, but all three computers are running pretty cool temps at this point. Of course the P4 build I am on now has about 5 case fans and 2 power supply fans....:)

Hi Deagle,

You posted while I was typing....

The picture you drew doesn't look much like it at all. I use the postit notes that are about an inch square and I put the sticky edge down flat on the chip bordering each side of the die. The frames it and covers almost all of the chip except for the die.

I'll look at the AS directions again to refresh my memory and post back...

[Budfred]

Ok, following review of the instructions and in simple terms:

Clean the heatsink surface and the CPU die with something like really pure alcohol (I use a 91% Isopropyl). Smear some AS on the heatsink, rub it in well with a clean plastic bag over your finger and then remove it with a lint free material. Don't use solvent on it to clean it...

If you follow the instructions, you have already put a little bit on the die and if you use the postits, you have already framed the die. You use the razor blade or credit card to spread it really really thin. Remove the postit notes with any overflow on them. Make sure there is no AS on the body of the chip, it should only be on the die. Place the heatsink carefully on it with minimal sliding around and clip it in place..... If all went well, you are ready to move on to the next step in the build...

I urge you to print out the AS instructions and read them over a couple of times if you need to, don't ignore some of the details that I left out to simplify things...

[Deagle]

Opps...hehe...so I was incorrect with my drawing eh? Ok, I'll try again. Here's (http://www.angelfire.com/linux/techiezer0/1700jiuhb.gif) is my 2nd attempt to guess what you mean. It should be obvious that I can't draw but those tan lines around the die is meant to be the sticky side of the notes and those 4 rectangles made with the black lines represents the notes spreading around the die.

Thanx your explanation is much more simpler and I will print out the instructions from that website as you have adviced.

:p

[Budfred]

I didn't even notice the black lines before. That is basically what I am talking about, but the postit notes actually overlap and cover a lot more of the chip than your drawing. You will see if you do it that way.

I'm glad my simple version helps....:)

[Deagle]

Hehe, the reason that you didn't see the black lines is because it wasn't there before;) Kool, since now I'm kinda getting what your talking about it makes sense more to me. I will post back when the processor arrive and ask more questions if I need to.
Thanx again for ALL of the helps.:)

PS: I'm gonna go and get those post-it notes tomarrow so if you could be kind enough to tell me the dimension of it like XX" by XX" then I would be very grateful.:p

[Budfred]

You're in luck, I just happen to have a ruler handy and my monitor is half covered with the postit notes. It appears to be 2 inches by 1.5 inches....

[BigBlue66]

Hey Deagle,

Get some AS Ceramique. Then you won't have to worry about post-it notes, razor blades, "screeding" :D, and all that other mumbo jumbo.

The only thing you do the same with Ceramique is to rub some into the base of the heatsink using your finger inside a soft sandwich baggy, then wiping it off with a coffee filter (lint free).

As for the core, all you do is place a small glob of Ceramique, about the size of one-half the size of an uncooked grain of rice, (see AS website), then install the heatsink and twist it ever so gently no more than 10 degrees in either direction. There, you're done.

[Variable]

ooh a neat tid bit. I never thought of the lint free=coffee filter idea.

Danke

V

[Whyzman]

"screeding":D , and all that other mumbo jumbo

Hehe...BB, did I fail to mention that my AS layer is perfectly uniform??? :p :D :D

Yes, Bwana BB...Did I fail to mention that I also color outside of the lines when it suits me??? :p :D :D

LOL...did I fail to mention that I also use the Ceramique and still "screed?" :cool: I helped put in too many driveways me thinks! :rolleyes:

[Whyzman]

Oops, forgot to mention Variable, as you're relatively new to the Guide and I don't know you all that well, be sure to not use the coffee filter to make coffee after cleaning the sink with it...

The after taste is perfectly gross! I can't say from personal experience...;) But I would gather that BB already knew that and just failed to add the warning/disclaimer...:D

[Deagle]

Hmm I just went and look at some reviews on the ceramique and it seems to perform just as well as AS3 plus the instructions for applying it is easier than AS3.:) BB, have you ever use ceramique before? If you have, give me your opinion about ceramique performance against AS3.
Well now I think that I will get ceramique since the process of applying it is easier.:cool:
:p

[BigBlue66]

Whyzman, what a comedian. :D

Yes Deagle, I've been using Ceramique for several months. I bought some as soon as it was available and have bought more since. I'm afraid of running out! hehe

As I think Whyzman is alluding to, you can spread the Ceramique just like you do ASIII, however, according to Arctic Silver, that is the wrong method to use. Just place a glob on the core and twist the sink to spread it out. It's not electrically conductive either.

I can say without a doubt that using Ceramique has reduced my temps by 2-3C.

I highly recommend it.

[Deagle]

Hmm..ok I was at arcticsilver's website and reading instructions on how to apply the ceramique and it was relatively more simple than AS3. So umm I'm gonna try and post here how I understand these steps and if its missing something, please tell me and I be grateful.:cool:

1-umm the SK-7 doesn't comes with a pad on it so I don't need to take it off. Although there is a plastic underneath the HS so I will take it off.
2-Lap the HS with instructions that was posted on my other post.
3-Wipe the HS with a lint-free cloth
4-Apply ceramique in the middle of the HS
5-Put a my finger in a zip-lock bag and proceed to spreading clockwise and counter.
6-Re-clean that area with a lint-free cloth (do I have to wipe it off totally?)
7-Squeeze a small amount of ceramique equal to a short grain of uncook rice onto the middle of the die or slug.
8-Mount the HS on top of the cpu per HS's instructions (I heard that this is the hardest part)
9-After successfully install the HS, grasp it and gently wiggle it in clockwise and counter 1 or 2 degree one time each way.

Thanx
PS: should I do this before I put the cpu into the socket or after its already inside the socket?:p

[Budfred]

I haven't used ceramique, but I can tell you about a couple of things....

After lapping the heatsink, don't just wipe it off, use the alcohol or other solvent to make sure any residue of oil, glue or other stuff is gone.

When you wipe the AS off of the heatsink, you do need to wipe it off so that it doesn't look like there is anything left except a stain. The stain is the part that gives you that really good connect.

This part I am not certain about, but I would think you would mount the heatsink on the CPU after you install the CPU... It would likely be trickier and messier if you didn't...