Will they work together?

[Bullman]

I finally recieved my DSL modem. This (http://www.qwest.com/dsl/customerservice/Actiontec1524.html) is the modem/router that I was sent. I guess it works also as a wireless if I contact Qwest or MSN and get the extra pieces. I don't want to use this combo as my wireless unit. Can anyone tell me if another router (such as a linksys wireless unit) will still work in conjunction with the Actiontec I was sent? I would use the Actiontec as the modem, then try and connect the router in the "typical" fashion. I am going to be going into town today and am ready to purchase the router. Setting these units up seems like it may be confusing if it is anything like configuring my DSL connection. Do the routers come with a very good manual that will explain different type setups? I am sure I will have plenty more questions once I get the router.

Also the free Zonealarm firewall I downloaded crashed my PC to a blue screen that said something about the bad command was VS datant. It also would not let me enter my online game (ie. Delta Force 2). I know it could be a configuration, but it and the game seemed to not get along very well at all. I know someone else that had the same exact problem. Do you have any suggestions on which other firewalls would work well and maybe easier to configure? Thanks.

[Budfred]

I don't think you will have any problem using the router with your new modem, but I am not expert in this area at all, so wait for more expert opinion.

As for ZA, I have found it to be unstable at times and avoid it now. It has some of the worst tech support of any product I have used. Sygate or Kerio are usually good alternatives and can be found through mjc's lists in the Application and Security forum. The one advantage ZA does have is that it is probably the easiest to configure though....

[PrntRhd]

On the ZA problem, it may be easier to go back one restore point to get the bad install removed.

The modem appears to be set up to connect with the supplied yellow cable to the NIC card in a client machine per the Actiontec website. It appears to be a 4 port router itself, plus wireless if you have the little card sticking out the side of it.
You can connect the other router to one of the four ethernet ports on the modem, but if it does not ping the router, try a crossover cable instead of a patch cable.

[Reid]

I do not think another router will operate if its input is connected to the output of the gateway you already have. It would probably cause some addressing conflicts. Someone else may have a better explanation. What you would probably need is a wireless access point to extend one of the gateway outputs wirelessly, but it sounds as if your gateway may already have wireless capability.

By the way, if you are running XP, Windows Update has a new release that covers a number of WAP issues.

[Bullman]

This is the first DSL modem I have ever seen, so I am not sure if it is physically configured like others. Don't most modems have 4 outgoing ports for for other PC's to be connected with? This model has a seperate port for a wireless card, and it kind of looks like a Laptop type looking wireless card that is used(but it has to be from Actiontec). To me the whole wireless part of it looks like a "proprietary" type setup. I am not sure if it would work, but I would like to connect a router to the number 1 outgoing connection from the modem. I would then like to connect the other pc's wireless off of the router. Also, what is the difference between a crossover cable and a patch cable?

I downloaded the Kerio Personal Firewall. I have never heard of this brand before (but that doesnt mean much from my limited experience), does anyone know if it is a good overall firewall? I have not had the problems I had with the ZA firewall. I have been able to access any program that I have needed to. If sygate or any of the others are better, please let me know. On a firewall, once I approve a program to accept info such as an online game, will it block an intruder from hacking my pc if that same person is playing in the same server? That may not make much sense, but I do not completely understand the things a firewall will block and that which it will not.

[PrntRhd]

Bullman,

Kerio is what mjc says he is running, a good recommendation I would say. You need to get a setup for firewall rules to get the firewall properly configured, as Kerio is a "rules-based" firewall.

Crossover cables look just like patch cables, they just have the wire pairs reversed to allow two computers to talk to each other without the need for a hub/switch. I have found the need to use a crossover cable as the uplink to a hub from a router in past experience.

How many computers will you need to connect with wires?

[Reid]

Originally posted by Bullman
Don't most modems have 4 outgoing ports for for other PC's to be connected with? I think the more common setup for home use is a separate modem unit with one output that is connected to one computer, or to a router/gateway for distribution to other computers in the network.

The output of your gateway is intended to communicate with your network, but I do not think it can work with a downstream router. The routers input is designed to work with a modem, and I do not think the addressing can work if you use a router downstream from the gateway you have.

[PrntRhd]

Reid,

All the computers will get the internet connection but you may not be able to see all the devices from the far end of the network.
That's why I asked how many clients were going to be connected, an additional router may not be needed.

[Reid]

Originally posted by PrntRhd
Reid,

... an additional router may not be needed. I agree, and moreover, I do not think a router will work downstream from the gateway he already has, which is what Bullman wants to try: "I am not sure if it would work, but I would like to connect a router to the number 1 outgoing connection from the modem. I would then like to connect the other pc's wireless off of the router.

I tried connecting a wireless router to the output of a wired router, just as an experiment, and it did not work.

[PrntRhd]

Reid,
With a crossover or patch cable?

[Reid]

Originally posted by PrntRhd
Reid,
With a crossover or patch cable? I used a patch cable, but this thread was started by Bullman, and I am not trying to figure out why my experiment did not work. Maybe I turned the whole discussion into apples and oranges, so I am out of here. Good luck, Bullman.

[PrntRhd]

No problem, I wanted to hear from Bullman on his requirements. It is Bullman we want to help.
If the experiment did not work I defer to Reid's expertise.

[Bullman]

No problem Reid, any type of input whether it has to do directly with my question or not may help. I can use all the help I can get.

I have my Main PC which is the only one hooked up now with a ethernet cable ( are ethernet cables the same as Cat5 cables?) I will want to hook up a total of three desktop PCs'. Right now I was thinking that I may try and run them hardwired to the modem/router combo. I will have to put a couple holes in the wall which I was trying to avoid, but I think it will be more secure and cheaper to do. What length is the furthest I would want to go with on a Cat5 cable, and is Cat5e cabling better than the Cat5? I think the furthest PC will be about 30ft. right now, but I want to get a longer cable in case we move them around to further parts of the room later. I think they kind of messed it up by sending me a combo instead of just a modem. I guess that way I have to buy more parts from their supplier. All will be WinXP and all have the LAN connections.

Almost forgot, the rooms are in a straight line from each other. Will it matter if I run the two cable along side of each other, or will there be some kind of interference? Will it matter if they are sheilded? I thought I read somewhere that they might interfere if cables were close to each other. Thanks everyone.

[PrntRhd]

Cat 5 cables are Ethernet ones.
Cat 5e is extended range, basically the same but a bit higher quality.
Both will work for your applications.
Both are twisted pair cables, this means they are designed to attenuate crosstalk, so they should work if laid parallel to each other.

Wireless range is about 300 meters outdoors and about 100 meters indoors, so is well above your requirements, should you wish to go that route.

The Actiontec you have is spec'ed to WiFi "b" which is 11MB/sec speed, so you want "b" wireless PCI adapters or PCMCIA cards for the clients connected for wireless if the clients do not have embedded wireless included (on the chip such as Centrino).

You may be broadcasting wireless even if hard wired, so check that out too.

[Bullman]

I have looked at the link I provided a little more. The router I have now would require me to add a card that plugs into the router itself. That card would then act as the antenna I guess, then sending out the wireless data. It will not work as wireless unless I purchase that card and then the PCI cards for the other PCs. I will do some more research, hopefully it is not able to broadcast anything wireless right now as the wireless slot on the modem/router is empty and covered.

Since the cables should work if run through the same opening, that looks like the route that I may go with right now. I guess I can always change to wireless in the future. I have a disk that configured my PC for me that came with the Modem. After I have the PC's all connected, should I run the same disk in each PC that way they will all be set up to connect to the internet? I am first going to try to get them seeing the internet first, then later down the line I will mess around with the file sharing and printer sharing. Will the File and Printer sharing work basically the same way hard wired as it would if it was wireless? Or is the file sharing specific to the Wireless router setup?

[PrntRhd]

Routing and File and Printer Sharing should be the same for wired or wireless. Without the card in the router it will not be broadcasting WiFi.

There are plenty of threads on Wireless here in PCGuide forums regards securing wireless networks in the last month or so.

I don't have direct info on whether you need to load the software onto each client for Quest service, depends on whether you want the same content for each I guess. Offhand I would guess you would load the software, but personally would try to see if I got access directly with a browser first.

I will want to hook up a total of three desktop PCs'.
Looks like you will not need a second device after all. :D

[pave_spectre]

To clarify some apparent confusion regarding connecting different type devices.;)

If not wanting to use the wireless function of the supplied gateway it would be possible to connect a seperate brand of wireless-access point (or external wired switch) to one of the switch-ports of the gateway. To do this with a straight-through patch cable requires that the new device such as THIS (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=33-124-002&catalog=335&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1) has an uplink port. To connect any device without an uplink port into the routers integrated switch would require the use of a crossover cable.

This is because you are dealing with the switch aspect of both devices, and when connecting any two like devices, ie PC-PC, switch-switch, a crossover cable must be used except where an uplink port is available.

[Bullman]

I now have 3 PCs' up an running on the internet! I have them all running the Kerio firewall. I also looked over the FAQ's about the modem/router, and I found this also.
_______________________________________________


Is my Home Gateway a firewall?

Yes. The Home Gateway provides its security through the use of NAT, which acts as a physical barrier between your network and the Internet. A configurable onboard firewall is also available and can be configured via the Actiontec 1524 Gateway web interface.

________________________________________________

I also have the WinXP firewall checked and running. Is there such thing as too much firewall? During downloading from a trusted site, is it ok to turn off the software firewall so there will be no interuptions? For example, I went to Microsoft update and downloaded some updates, and during installation the rule prompt stopped the installation. I had to approve several prompts b4 the installation would go any further. I trust the downloads from Microsoft for the most part (hehe), and would like to know if the software firewall has to run non-stop. Will the router firewall be enough for short periods at a time.

BTW, all cables are still running up and down the hallways, lol. I am going to do the mods on the walls on Sunday. I just wanted to try it b4 I did to much damage to the house. Thanks for all your help again everyone. I could never have done this on my own.

[Budfred]

DO NOT run Kerio and the WinXP firewall at the same time, it will cause problems. The router and software firewalls can be run together and it is actually a good idea to do that.

As for running without a firewall. I followed a bad suggestion last weekend and ended up losing my ability to get email or open web pages. In restoring this, I ended up negating my security patches for Win2K and uninstalling my firewall. I went online to see if I get it back for a few minutes without my firewall and without knowing my security patches were no good. I got hit by the Welchia worm. NAV supposedly caught it, but it didn't really so I had to clean it up later. This was literally less than five minutes without a firewall and the only site I went to was a site dedicated to fighting spyware... pretty trusted!! Don't run without the firewall if at all possible....

[PrntRhd]

Great news, Bullman!
You do want to examine the hardware firewall settings in the router to check how restrictive they are..default is usually wide open in my experience.

:D :D :D

[Reid]

Originally posted by PrntRhd
No problem, I wanted to hear from Bullman on his requirements. It is Bullman we want to help.
If the experiment did not work I defer to Reid's expertise. Sorry about my abrupt remark, but I just thought I was confusing the issue, so I left it to others.

I have found 802.11b networking to be underperforming and a pain to try to get working (maybe I just had the wrong hardware), so I stuck with a wired network, which is faster and more secure.

[Bullman]

All the modifications are now done. The wife is happy the house is still in one piece. I guess now I can use the cool smile again.:cool: :cool: :cool: Thanks again everyone!!:cool: