Can we do a Dell rant?

[DigitalJ]

I have a friend who seems to be hell bent on buying himself a Dell. I can't seem to talk him out of it. Can Those Who Know More Than I show him the ways?

I tried explaining that they only use intel, which IMO sucks.
I tried explaining that he'd void his warranty if he tried installing RAM himself.
I tried explaining that tech-support is hit and miss...at best.

All he sees is the price. Anyone have lots to add? :)

[Budfred]

The prices are not that good... If you look at the actual price that you pay, it is substantially higher than their ads indicate... Also the components they use are often not top of the line and they even cripple some of them... Their power supplies tend to be pathetic, so don't try to add to the computer... Their service quality has dropped farther and faster than probably any other computer company in history and they keep doing more and more to abandon their customers...

Tell your friend to look around a bit more at prices... There are a lot of deals available out there for more computer at less money...

[123456]

Tell him/her/it that the low priced PC's are 3 year old technology.

[pop pop]

Dell is nothing if not a master at marketing. In fact, they're brilliant. That's how they got to be so big. Their marketing and pricing now though is part of what's wrong with the PC industry. They've got people thinking that computers are like toasters--cheap, throw aways.

Part of their marketing is scam...bait and switch. They advertise that you can get a complete computer for $299 but when all is said and done (all the arm twisting and pressure sales) it's much more. Now even if you stood firm and got that PC for $299, it's a piece of crap and the warrantee is worthless. But people don't believe that. All they "think" about is Dell is the biggest name in PCs, so it must be good. Wrong...bad power supplies, proprietary parts, loow end CPUs, generic RAM, crappy warrantee.

I've stopped trying to talk people out of Dells. Personally, I think it's like a drug addiction. The people who insist on Dell can't or won't see the problems. They need a twelve step program.

[i an not a nerd]

Dell...... good moniters. Um..... thats it.

[saphalline]

I guess it depends on what your friend wants to use this new computer for, which model of Dell computer (desktop I assume?), and whether or not your friend is OK with the idea of a disposable computer.

Largely, I agree with pop pop - it's nearly useless to try and talk someone out of a Dell if they're hell-bent on buying one. I can tell them what I think and why, but hey! It's their money! The only point I try and make to people buying a Dell is: don't come crying to me when you have problems! Most of the people I know have learned their lesson, and they don't mention their Dells around me anymore...

[Quazzimodo]

Whats bad aswell is you see your pc advertised for £400 and then when you go to buy it jumps up to something like £500 and then you find out the graphics card, is absolute ****e, and what ever you do dont buy the cards off their site.

[Quazzimodo]

ooops sorry bout the swearing , didnt know it was banned
sorry

[classicsoftware]

I always try to stay on the good side of people who buy Dell PC's. That way I can fix them when they break. :D Which they will. I once went to one of my clients and bid a nice high end system. He choose a Packard Bell. The first service call ate up all of the savings and he still had a POS. :eek: The next time he purchased what I suggested...... Some people are slow learners. Just remember a cheap person knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.

The problem is any other business would be investigated by every level of government. They are bait and switch, plain and simple. They are there to sell you as much as they can. They have no desire to sell you what you need, they sell you what they need.

If you compare apples to apples, you can always either beat the price or pay a little more and get a better PC. As Pop-Pop will attest, I can get a pretty nice system with XP Pro and 512MB RAM for $500.00 and 1 year of on-site service. If your friend want's one, let me know and I'll find a supplier in his area or sell it to him myself. This is not a high end PC, it's not for business or gaming. But for the average home user it's a really nice computer. Well built and stylish to boot.

Just give Dell their due, they have succeeded in selling an inferior product and they are making money hand over fist. And one more thing, their award winning service and support requires you speak hindi and even that is not included in the $299.00 model.

[123456]

Support that requires you to speak Hindi....lol.
Their notebooks are good paperweights.

[Sempron]

I tried explaining that he'd void his warranty if he tried installing RAM himself. OMFG!! are you serious? how outrageous is that? That's like telling a new car owner that if he lifts his hood up his waranty's void. LAME

Just remember a cheap person knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.I thought that was a cynic :D

It's a shame when a company takes advantage of customers that have very little knowledge of the product their trying to sell. More reason to do your homework before making any big decision.

[Budfred]

I am trying to help someone at work select a computer right now and she is do overwhelmed by the options that she may just end up ordering a Dell so she can have me sort them out for her online... The salespeople at the stores just keep throwing more options at her and jacking up the price until she gives up and leaves... They lose a sell and she feels more overwhelmed... This may be one of the biggest reasons Dell continues to be successful.... :(

[DigitalJ]

The salespeople at the stores just keep throwing more options at her and jacking up the price until she gives up and leaves... They lose a sell and she feels more overwhelmed... This may be one of the biggest reasons Dell continues to be successful.... :(

That's the reason all of them are successful. Irritated the hell out of me when I was selling them....and even now. There's nothing I'd like more than to open up my own chop shop and sell new/refurbed machines. But how in the hell can I compete with that kind of buying power?

I had a gateway salesman try to jack my girlfriend into buying a system that was made for gaming. He simply wouldn't hear it when I told him he was out of his mind, and that unlike the small computer illiterate girl he was jacking, I knew wtf I was talking about and he could lick....alright, nevermind that story. :cool:

Anyway, thanks for the input guys, I shall pass the info on.

[saphalline]

Oh the stories we could all tell. :rolleyes: And I'm sure we all have quite a few of them...

Orion and I have perfected the art of "putting the salesmen in their place". ;) Both of us together can clear away the pushers in less than 5 minutes. They always leave with their tails between their legs, no doubt off to lick their wounds and cry themselves to sleep.

Ahh, it feels so good to be mean to idiots and jack@$$es. I hope it's not wrong of me to think that way! :eek:

[Rick]

If you do get a Dell tech that can speak a Little english.
Be ready for the shock of becoming a tech yourself.
Even if you have NO idea of what they are asking.

IE: told to remove Battery AND Hard drive to test boot a laptop
before they guy even asked if I knew what a hard drive was or where it was :)

Then after that came the normal . Put it in OUR BOX and ship it to KY for repair ..

[123456]

At least hp asks if you are comfortable with opening up something.

[Rick]

What I can't see is this.

If they can tell me to remove the hard drive from a laptop
Then How could adding hardware ( Like Memory) void the warrantee ?
That is IF that statement is true

[123456]

Just a way to make more $$$ by having their services install it for you.

[DigitalJ]

Ahh, it feels so good to be mean to idiots and jack@$$es. I hope it's not wrong of me to think that way! :eek:

Not at all, my good man. They want to jack you out of your hard earned money, make em work for it :) They're just doing their jobs I guess. Salesmen are supposed to sell. Maybe that's why I was never a good one. My old boss always hated the fact that I sold people exactly what they needed at the ceapest price. Don't know why I would try to sell a 70-year old woman a high end rig, but apparently that's what you're supposed to do *shrugs*

[classicsoftware]

A good salesman will sell you what you need. I just sold a system for $450.00. I have sold systems for $2500.00. You match the systen to the customer. That's what an honest salesman does. The trouble is most of the salesman have no idea what they are talking about. They wouldn't know a motherboard from a chipset,from a hard drive.

[saphalline]

Don't know why I would try to sell a 70-year old woman a high end rig, but apparently that's what you're supposed to do *shrugs*That type of mentality just irks me. Best Buy and all the other large chain tech stores used to do this in droves. Fortunately most of them have eased up on this (at least in my area) although it's still not entirely gone.

And the small shops are no different. Especially when it comes to "gaming" systems. :rolleyes: I recently was in a local shop (that shall remain nameless) and they had a budget gaming system, under $1000 for the box. Guess what vid card they used? Radeon 9200! :eek: Sad... very sad...

[Variable]

Installing third party RAM into a Dell does not void your warranty :rolleyes:
Where do you guys get this stuff? lol
I believe, to do so would be in violation of US law. Maybe it's not the same in other countries though.

[classicsoftware]

As per the Dell Limited Warranty:

Problems caused by using accessories, parts, or components not supplied by Dell

This would include memory. While I would like to pummell Dell for this, it's pretty standard accross the whole spectrum of computer manufacturers.

[Variable]

That little snippet doesn't explain much im afraid. There is a general rule that if you put any part into a machine not meant for the machine it "may" void the warranty i.e. putting the wrong kind of RAM or CPU into a motherboard. I would simply point to many sites that sell memory that explain that installing third party ram into a machine does not void your warranty.

[PrntRhd]

Crucial's guarantee of 100% compatability usually trumps the OEM's claims of warranty violation by installation of aftermarket memory.

[jlreich]

I think what the statement Classic quoted is saying that if you put a third party component in the machine they will not be responsible for it. If you install another brand of ram and you HDD fails they will still replace it. But if say they think the ram somehow fried the mobo then you are SOL.

Here is a good one. It isn't about Dell, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was.

The secretary at work was giving an old computer to someone in exchange for some work done to her house. While she was clearing out her personal files she bumped into the tray of the old 4X CD-ROM that was out and broke it. She called I think it was HP but not sure, and they told her sure we can send you a new one for $160. :eek:

Well I immediately had her order a $20 CD-RW from Newegg and put it in for her. No problems. Why would they do that?? I mean of course for the money, but that's a complete ripoff. :mad:

[Jesuli]

Let me tell you a story. It's meaning is to tell you that there are worse things than a Dell. Yes, I agree with most of you,Dell is pretty bad and I'm not gonna get another from them, thats for sure. I'm gonna build my next computer myself.

I have a Dell Dimension 4500. I bought it in early 2001 I think. Back then I just wanted to buy the easiest choice. And with Dell I could configure the things a bit, which was enough for me. I configured it to have some extra memory and sligthly better CPU and GPU. My Dell has 2 GHz P4, 512 mb of memory and Geforce 4200 TI. It has worked fine. I haven't had any problems with it. My friend bought a Packard Bell in 2003. Well he got screwed pretty bad. His computer has 2.8 GHz Celeron, 512 mb DDR RAM and Radeon 9200 256 mb. He was said it was a good gaming machine. :eek: He paid about 1000$ for it. Those numbers(2.8,512,256) sounded pretty good back then.

A while ago we both ran 3dMark03. I got 1500 points but my friend only got 1000! :eek: Think about it, my computer is 2 years older and i only paid 500$ more for it and still it beats my friends computer that clearly. And lately my friend has started thinking of upgrading his computer. He noticed that the motherboard had a socket 478 and with socket 478 the upgrade possibilities are pretty slim. And he also has only 2 RAM slots and they are both in use. That makes it expensive to upgrade to 1 GB of RAM.

So his so called gaming machine was worse than my 2 years old Dell computer even at the time and its upgrade possibilities are also poor. And he got only 1 year warranty for it too.

[hockey man]

Yep, Dell is going down the porcillin god. A celeron for a gamer!! What a liar! Thats why you need to reaserch them before you buy!

[Erik]

I have never dealt with Dell personally, but I get the feeling that it isn't really there to force you to buy parts from them. I think it is more like "if you fry the computer by installing something wrong, it isn't covered by the warranty".

Generally though I don't really like Dell PCs. The ones that are decent priced machines are way underpequipped even to just run Windows. Then trying to make it a decent machine costs a ton of money, and you still get a bunch of no name parts and not many real options. Also with the real low end machines you get basically no way to upgrade as everything is part of the MB and can't be disabled in BIOS to add cards on.

The best thing about buying a Dell is that you get plenty of bundeled software. I could pretty easily build a PC for $300-$500, but wouldn't be able to even install a legal copy of Windows for that price. At least with a Dell for that price you get a running machine with WIndows, and an office suite installed.

[hockey man]

True, but they do like to try to sell you xp systems with 256 RAM!

[saphalline]

XP runs just fine on 256MB of RAM. Even with onboard video taking away from the total (and performance) you can get by on that. 512MB is better, but 256MB is enough, especially when compared to 128MB! :eek:

I seem to be servicing a lot of systems lately running WinXP with too little RAM. I recently helped a neighbor with his laptop: mobile Celeron 850, 128MB of RAM (minus 8MB for onboard video), and really slow 10GB hard drive, running XP Home. The sad thing is, it came with XP! It's not like they had 98 or ME and upgraded to XP - oh no! It just came that way! PC's are still being sold with too little RAM. Anything under 256MB is just not quite enough for XP. I mean really, the minimum for XP is 128MB just to run the OS! That's not including any open programs! Those minimums from M$ should really be increased a bit. If the OS itself needs 128MB, make the minimum 192MB or something. Don't lead people to believe that they can run an XP system on the bare minimum for the OS.

It's kind of funny in a way, though. I often get asked "how much RAM do you have?" I answer them with "1GB, but I've been thinking of doubling that." It's always funny to see their reaction. :p Most of the systems I see are running 256-512MB, and of course people always think that "lots" of RAM costs a fortune and isn't worth it. Hah! 512MB is the minimum these days for a casual use system, 1GB is the minimum for a gaming system, and 2GB is now cost-effective enough to recommend for medium- to high-end systems! RAM is cheap, get a lot of it.

Of course, upgradability is always a problem for OEM systems. Especially those based on "value" CPU's. That's one of the reasons I wanted to start my list of parts. I wanted to show people that you don't have to cut your system off at the knees just because you want a Celeron or a Sempron. In Jesuli's story, his friend got a system based on a Celeron and he suffered from a corner-cutting manufacturer. Why should "value" CPU be associated with "cheap-@ss"!? There's really no reason for it. You can put together a perfectly capable system based on a Celeron and have plenty of room to upgrade! In fact, if you get the right mobo, you can buy a Celeron D today and upgrade to a Pentium D later! You won't get those kinds of options from an OEM! At least, not the big ones like Dell or HP or Packard Bell (are they still around?).

Now, there are people who are quite happy with their Dell's and HP's. But you don't often see them around here! ;) Those are the people who don't know a lot about PC's, don't want to know a lot about PC's, and are quite willing to just buy a new PC every year or two if it will save them the hassle of "working on it". Sort of like fast food. Sometimes, the convenience is well worth the price. And of course when those people do eventually upgrade and toss out their old PC, I'll be there to "take it off their hands"... :D

[Variable]

Crucial's guarantee of 100% compatability usually trumps the OEM's claims of warranty violation by installation of aftermarket memory.

There is no OEM claim of warranty violation by installation of aftermarket memory...You have to install devices that will work in the machine. If you break your machine installing the wrong hardware from another manufacturer it won't be covered by Dell. But that true for any device sold by anyone. You install a turbo on your new Mustang and blow your motor Ford won't cover it... Key word is wrong.

http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/kb/en/document?dn=1057010

[jlreich]

256 is enough. But 512 is way better. And 1GB is quite comfortable. 256 just doesn't leave much breathing room for anything other than the OS and a browser open, and maybe something else small. Most of the Dells at work have 256. Everyone is always complaining how slow office programs open. Even after I have shut down unnecessary services and such.

And of course when those people do eventually upgrade and toss out their old PC, I'll be there to "take it off their hands"...

Oh yes. I just got an HP 933Mhz P3 system from a guy at work that was going to literally just throw it in the trash. :eek: The only thing wrong with it was the PSU died. Gave me the monitor and all. The trackball and printer even. :eek: It only has 128 ram, but soon as I scrounge up some sdram it will be a nice extra computer.

And what did he do? Instead of letting me fix it, he just went out and bought a new E-Machine. :confused: Well at least he listened when I told him whatever he does don't get a Dell. :rolleyes: But hey he is happy with his much faster computer. ;)

Why should "value" CPU be associated with "cheap-@ss"!? There's really no reason for it. You can put together a perfectly capable system based on a Celeron and have plenty of room to upgrade! In fact, if you get the right mobo, you can buy a Celeron D today and upgrade to a Pentium D later! You won't get those kinds of options from an OEM!
Absolutely! That is the advantage of building or having someone build it for you. Even it it costs a little more it is much better. You just don't get the same kind of upgrade options from an OEM. Not to mention the warranty in terms of years not months. ;)

[Mini-Me]

Wow, you guys don't seem to have had much fun with Dell.
:(

I have not had any problems with the machines themselves, although I must be perfectly honest here, and state that I had LOTS of experience working on the P100 series of Optiplex Gs system, etc, and I thought they were superb in their day - the pull apart dead easy, and you almost didn't need a screwdriver...

There was no CPU fan, and the PSU fan was very quiet, which made these machines attractive to quite a few people.

NOW DAYS, i don't know - has the build quality dropped, do you think, or is it just salsemen trying to get you to buy extras you don't need, do you think?

...certainly an interesting thread for me to read, anyway...

My sister has a Dell laptop(she lives in Tallahassee), and she thinks it's great - she has not reported any probs with it; she's had it for about 2 years.(was new when she bought it)


MM.

[saphalline]

Yes, the build quality has dropped considerably. I've worked on a few of those early Dell and Gateway machines, too. Awesome systems, large cases, very practical build techniques, good quality hardware, and very upgradable.

Now... they suck! Cramped little mini-towers, oftentimes so complex that I've had to look online to figure out how to get at the RAM for instance! "Pull tab A down 1mm then swing out to a 97.5 degree angle; at the same time, push tab B into an upright position. The hard drive should now pop free." :rolleyes: I could go on and on and on and on and on, but I won't! I think you get the idea.

From what I've heard and seen, Dell's laptops are pretty good. When they work. If they break and you have to talk to tech support, well... Your sister might want to learn a second language...

[jlreich]

From what I've heard and seen, Dell's laptops are pretty good. When they work. If they break and you have to talk to tech support, well... Your sister might want to learn a second language...
My work bought 5 Dell laptops 2 years ago. Two of the batteries died within the year warranty and were replaced. The other three batteries died shortly after the year warranty was up. At around $150 each they were never replaced. :(

5 Dell laptops, 5 dead batteries. Low quality parts. ;)

[Variable]

Most of my Dell experience is with Servers. The servers are very easy to work on. A lot of thought has gone into making it a snap to replace parts. You look inside and you can tell some smart folks designed it.

Don't really have much experience upgrading the newest Dell PC's. The Dell PC's I have had to work on were very easy to work with. They seem to be designed to use few screws. Probably to make factory builds easier, but when your doing an upgrade on 10 at a time... I like the fact that I don't need to keep track of dinky screws that tend to fall off into the case. Good for the factory and good for me.

Small cases suck in general, especially if your like me and have large hands. People like the small foot prints of small cases, but when you have to work on them it can be frustrating.

On a side note. Setting up several hundred new Dell pc's over the years I have noticed that identical machines are not all equal. You have some that boot much slower than others and some boot much faster. You put 30 new PC's up and turn them all on and sit back and you can see that they are not all equal.

[PrntRhd]

Most of my Dell experience is with Servers. The servers are very easy to work on. A lot of thought has gone into making it a snap to replace parts. You look inside and you can tell some smart folks designed it.
Dell servers are fine.
Dell also brought the support for business back into the country because they found out I.T. professionals would not tolerate second-class support.
A shame they treat PC consumers with such low regard.

[Mini-Me]

What a facinating(and eye-opening) thread...

...in a depressing/frustrating way...
:(

Dell have pamplets out all the time here in NZ, and they are always offering good prices on their range of machines.

You ring them up, so I understand, and they will deliver the package directly to your door, + GST(goods & services tax) and freight.
No need to go shopping for a PC, just find the one you want on-line or in the junk-mail(US read: flyer), phone up, and it's sent to you - no need to hunt through shops looking at all these machine setups.

Sounds like a good idea, ALTHOUGH:

One of our budget chain-stores over here has started selling Dell packages in their shops - the chain is well known for cheap garbage in all the areas of stuff they sell, so when Dell first came into their shop as something they were selling, I must admit that at the time it was a "Hmmmmmmm......" moment; why would they be selling Dell? Arn't they supposed to be good? Shouldn't one of the other electrical/computer shops be selling them? Isn't that how Dell would want it?

Anyway, that is quite a shame for me to hear, that the build-quality would seem to have become a forgotten term to Dell.
:(

...a shame, cos they are effectively cutting their own throat, by building on the super-cheap, and selling high to increase their profit margins - the buying public are not forgiving if they think they are being shafted...


MM.

[poppy]

Degradation of the PC Experience followed by LackLuster service! :p

[Mini-Me]

Tee hee hee!
:D


MM.

[Variable]

Dell also brought the support for business back into the country because they found out I.T. professionals would not tolerate second-class support.

I dunno, I have called them a few times in the last few months and talked to guys with really bad Indian accents. Maybe they are transplants. The support is done by teams. They have names like bronze and gold. Usually your first group is from India and then you talk to Americans. I think the last group I talked to was in Texas. Hold times are pretty low and the call backs are quick. Same with MS. They both have some really smart people on their support teams. MS is full of support from India. If they are really bad we put them on the speaker so everyone can hear the conversation. It can be ... funny. All you have to do is say "Can I speak to someone who can speak English?"
The worst support I have gotten is from Apple; inept, poor customer service skills and long holds but they were all Americans.... :rolleyes:

[i an not a nerd]

One of the things that I find annoying about the cheap systems is that they kinda give customers the feeling that "hey my computer broke but who cares, i can get a new one like that!". Then they throw the old computer out on the curb where someone walks by, takes it, fixes it, and salvages all the info on the HD (identity thieves). What is funny about the info part is that taking the info is perfectly legal if someone throws the computer out!

[Orion]

Well, I will never buy a dell myself (though I might be tempted by one of their XPS laptops, were I into really heavy, theoretically portable gaming machines) and I would not recommend anyone buy certain kinds...but one has to look a little deeper.

First off, for the tinkerer or long-term planner, Dell committed the ultimate Line-of-Duty-No. The Power supply fiasco, which I beleive may be corrected at this point, was simply unforgivable. You have to consider, though, that many people don't mind replacing their whole computer after the warranty is expired. therefore they would just go to customer service...

Which brings up the major point. Customer service was what originally brought many people to dell-in fact, I remember when Dell was just starting, and the general consensus was that Dell had average to substandard parts, but they did their job, were cheap, and best of all, had completely Stellar customer service. They've been getting flack from people primarily because that has changed. I have heard of totally different stories, however-which made me wonder what the difference was?

My Grandmother helped me figure this one out. The Laptop her programming job gave her (she worked for NorthWest Airlines, programming and training people on the computer systems) was a dell, and at one point, the cooling fan died. I advised her that she may have a problem finding someone who spoke english, and if she did, just to insist that they simply send her a new fan. To both of our surprise, not only did she get someone who spoke english, but was located in Georgia (I beleive-I know it was down south). the ultimate shock came when she quickly, succinctly, and professionally troubleshot the problem, listened to my grandmother explain what was happening, sent out the new fan for free, and gave my Grandmother her direct line so that she could help walk my grandmother through replacing it! This made us quite curious.

I had mentioned to my grandmother that this was unusual, and that perhaps there was something odd going on-like a separation of their business accounts vs home, etc. when they gave a follow up call (somehting which took us for a loop again!) she took it upon herself to ask the gal about the difference. The gal (again, voluntarily) said that apparently the optiplex and latitude lines (thier business lines) recieved service from on-continent call centers of trained technicians, while the home lines (pavilion and inspirion) support calls "got routed to Abu Dhabi" (after all, we all know that everywhere in india is called Abu Dhabi...).

From this I can only conclude that there are two very different Dells. There is the business Dell and the home dell. they both may use substandard parts (though I haven't heard of too many problems with the latitude or optiplex lines) but at least the sales of the business lines are much less pushy (I checked it out, since my grandpa, who is a Tandem programmer-private contractor, has a business account with them) and has the old award-winning customer service...or at least should.

The home lines, though, I would be ashamed to run.

Orion

[Mini-Me]

This thread gets more interesting by the day!!!
:cool:

If you guys will please indulge me for a moment, I have just finished building a clean-install on Win98 on a Dell machine.

It is an Optiplex Gs system; an older system by todays' standards, with a P166 CPU.

THIS particular model is BEAUTIFUL, and I have yet to find other PC's either modern or older, that are as well thought out as this thing.

Now, don't get me wrong - I understand the problems with the modern machines, but i'm talking about a retro model here...
;)

Press in two push-buttons at the rear, and the whole case-top hinges off.

Great!
:)

Inside, the mainboard is well laid out, with easily id'd parts, and the CPU speed setting is excellent - simply put the jumper on the pins which represent the speed of CPU you are plonking in there...

Simplicty itself...

Where's the on-board VGA? - oh, right there.
What about the PCI-set? - naturally...

And with the flick of a lever, out pops the ISA/PCI bus riser assembly, for super-easy installation/removal of add-on cards...

Also, you pull back a couple of steel tabs, and the whole floppy drive can be removed, followed by the CD-ROM drive. Reassembly is sheer delight - slide the CD-ROM and it's carrier back in, and then hinge the floppy drive back in, and it clicks into place.

Wonderful!

I wish all modern PC's were built like those old Dell's were...

Please note: I am not supporting the current Dell's, but rather trying to illustrate how brilliant a concept these older models are/were...

A pity, perhaps, that Dell have obviously chosen not to develop modern machines along the same lines as the old Optiplex Gs models...


MM.

[123456]

Gee, I wish my dell xps t450+550 had those two buttons. You have to undo screw and press two hinges that are hard as hell to open. THen you must remove a support beam, but everything rom there is laid out nicely.

[Fruss Tray Ted]

I have an Optiplex GXA with a P2 233mhz and maxed out the RAM but I never thought of it as 'attractive'... AAMOF, I only date uh, see her uh, it once a week or so and we even live in seperate houses! After all, it's better that way... :eek:

Yes the case is very 'functional' like a woman uh, pc should be. Problem is, she uh, it weighs a ton! :D

User friendly though... built for comfort, not for speed. :p

[123456]

I guess the XPS T--- series was designed for performance.

[Mini-Me]

Fruss-Tray-Ted: LOL!!!!!
:D
:D


MM.

[odannyboy000]

i have a dell 8300 series and have had it for 2 years now. it has been very reliable for me....although i did ad ram, buy a new graphics card, new hard drive, new psu, new dvd drives...but thats just cause i wanted better stuff. but, i am on my dell right now and it still runs GREAT. when i bought it new it was ~1700 dollars. if i didnt change any of the parts it would probably still be good, because i bought one of their higher end models. NOW, I AGREE THAT THE LOW END MODELS SUCK!!!! THEY HAVE BAD PARTS AND THE HARD DRIVE BREAKS IN ABOUT 1 YEAR. but, if you want to buy the 8500? or xps i would say let him. they arent bad.

[i an not a nerd]

If you are gonna spend the amount of $$$ on an XPS system, you might as well use Alienware, Voodoo, All American Computers, etc. one of the big gaming brand names.

Actually, if I recall correctly, Toms had a series of reviews of different computer builders systems......

[Elwood]

My last computer was a Dell that I bought way back in 2001. I am now faced with upgrading the PC and there is no way I can do it cheaper than building a new one myself. I am expecting a "little one" soon so I need to get a camcorder as well. My dilemma is my Dell 8100 is 1.5G, 128MB RAM isn't going to allow me edit any video (I don't think).

So, I have just been putting off the inevitable; giving it to my family and building another one.

[saphalline]

My dilemma is my Dell 8100 is 1.5G, 128MB RAM isn't going to allow me edit any video (I don't think).Ahahahahaaaa! 128MB of RAM? Hahahaaaaa! Unless you're giving that thing to a disliked family member, consider upgrading the RAM! Most of us here running power systems have 8 times that much RAM! And I'm even considering upgrading to 2GB!

I really hate those OEM pieces of junk with a fast CPU and a pitiful amount of RAM.

[Mini-Me]

I use my machine for video editing, and DVD authoring of camcorder material. Also for MP3 encoding, and DivX. It uses an Athlon XP 3000+ CPU, 1GB(1000MB) DDR RAM, 3 x 120GB 7200RPM drives, 1 x 80GB 7200RPM drive and 1x 60GB 7200 RPM drive(all Seagate Barracuda's), DVD-writer drive, XP-pro, etc. There is a PCI IDE controller added, to access the extra drives. The 120GB drives are just recording buffers. Recording is via a Pinnacle DV/AV card, at full DV quality(12GB per hour!). This system is JUST ENOUGH in my opinion, for video editing with any kind of speed at all. Anything less then this, and you will find the editing process very time consuming and frustrating...

[Elwood]

Okay, where can I find the cheapest PC800 ECC RAM that is compatible? Dell wants $349.99 for 1 stick of 512, and of course 2 are required. From my search, Dell doesn't have any other sizes available.

This is why I will never buy another Dell.

[PrntRhd]

Elwood,
I recommend Crucial. It is usually reasonably priced and is guaranteed to work with the PC for life.
www.crucial.com

[Elwood]

They do not make this kind of memory and refer me back to Dell.

I get this message.

We're Sorry!
No products are currently available for the system you selected. Your system may require proprietary or non-standard parts.

But thanks for the suggestion anyway.
Regards

[poppy]

Having RDRAM(RAMBUS) memory is going to cost. Newegg's price for a module is $346.17:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145150

Do a Google search for "memory upgrade" and start checking some of the memory suppliers and see if they have anything compatible.

[Elwood]

I agree, I know it's expensive. Which is my reason for not wanting to dump much money into it.

Thanks for the link.

[saphalline]

It's a Dell! Come on! Why put that much more memory into it? 128MB is really not enough for WinXP, but adding another 1GB to a computer that's being given away? What's the point?

You could just add two sticks of 256MB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820147310) or 128MB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820151003) and save yourself a ton of money! And are we sure that ECC is in there now?

[Elwood]

I am pretty positive that it uses ECC. I will examine it futher tonight and find out for sure. If so, I will consider the cheaper RAM you sugessted. It shouldn't conflict with my other 2 sitcks of 64MB Dell OEM crap, right?

Thanks for the link, Saph.

[saphalline]

It shouldn't conflict with my other 2 sitcks of 64MB Dell OEM crap, right?Actually, that particular RAM was supplied by Intel.

When the P4 first came out, its speeds weren't quite fast enough to outperform the higher speed PIII's, and it used expensive RDRAM. In order to boost sales, Intel sold special retail versions of the early P4's (mostly to OEM partners but also a few to resellers like Newegg) with 2 sticks of 64MB RDRAM.

The RAM came free with the P4's, so all those OEM systems you see with early P4's and 128MB of RDRAM total are a bundle together. They didn't even add any of their own RAM! :eek: Just shows how cheap those OEM companies are, huh? ;)

[Elwood]

beautiful, freaking beautiful.

Okay, per Everst, this is what I have.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


[ RIMM1: Samsung MR16R 0824BN1-CK8 ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name Samsung MR16R 0824BN1-CK8
Serial Number 25856C00h
Manufacture Date Week 5 / 2001
Module Size 64 MB (4 devices, 32 banks)
Module Type RIMM Module
Memory Type RDRAM
Memory Speed PC800 (400 MHz)
Module Width 16 bit
Module Voltage 2.5 V

Memory Module Features:
HeatSpreader Present
Thermal Sensor Not Present

Memory Module Manufacturer:
Company Name Samsung
Product Information http://www.samsung.com/Products/Semiconductor/DRAM/index.htm


Now when I go to Dell's website and put in my Service Tag #, I get that I need RDRAM, PC800, ECC, Unbuffered.

now, I just pulled out a module and it doesn't say ECC anywhere.

[Erik]

ECC RAM would be compatible, and my guess would be that ECC is all that Dell happens to have left in stock, as RDRAM isn't really used anymore. They just want to push it on you to make the money, with no regard for if you really need the extra features or not.

[saphalline]

now, I just pulled out a module and it doesn't say ECC anywhere.No, it probably wouldn't. I rarely see useful info on a stick of RAM pulled from an OEM system. If you buy it yourself, it will have 2 very informative stickers on it. But not from your Dell.

If Everest and Dell say it's ECC, then it's ECC. If you want to put more RAM in that thing, go ahead. Two of those 128MB sticks (plus the two 64's in there now) would give you 384MB total, which isn't too shabby. Look at this way: if you're giving it away, and if you've been using 128MB of RAM all this time, it's a heck of a deal for who ever gets it!

[Elwood]

thanks for the help.

Sorry if I appeared to hijack the thread.