Now HERE'S a stupid question

[Dan Mitchell]

After a bit of input and some initial reading on some of the sites suggested here, I'm pretty much sold on assembling my own PC. The actual hardware assembly part seems pretty straightforward (if not the selection of the various bits) but I'm wondering about an OS. Much as I'd prefer a REALLY viable option, I guess that's going to mean Windows. So I priced 98 & 2000, and I about fell outta my chair. CDW sells Windows 98 2.0 full edition for $187, upgrade goes for $100. Windows 2000 (which is "I guess" preferable to 98) goes for $276 in the full edition, $190 in the upgrade. Needless to say, I'd prefer an alternate and less costly way of obtaining these. My only experience with loading an OS was upgrading my present 90mhz pentium for 3.1 to 95, using a disk from my former employer, which I still have (the disk, not the employer ;-). At the very least, could I load the old 95 on the new PC, then "upgrade" with an upgrade version of 2000 (at least saving ~$90)? Or will the "upgrade" just load w/o something "there" first. And speaking of having something "there" first (here comes the really stupid part), what do you get when you fire up an newly build PC for the first time? There's no OS, so how do you load an OS???? What appears on the screen (hey, I SAID it was STUPID ;-) ?

Thanks,

Dan

[Paleo Pete]

I would stick with win 98. For most home users win2000 is not really necessary, it's designed more for business and networking use, and I'm not entirely positive they've worked all the bugs out. Some of the folks here use 2000 and like it pretty well though, they might have bore dependable info about it. Hardware compatibility is one thing you'll need to make sure and check. Like NT, win2000 will not support all hardware. Make sure you check the MS Hardware Compatibility List (http://www.microsoft.com/hcl/default.asp).

Check Pricewatch (http://pricewatch.com) you might find better prices, although shipping may be a problem depending on location. Watch out for ther sites that don't post shipping charges, it's usually way too much.

Installing: If you have the win95 CD it's not necessary to actually install it to install 98, possibly the same for 2000. When I install I copy the win 98 directory to the hard drive and install from there, when setup looks for an existing OS just browse to the CD ROM drive and have the win 95 CD there. IT sees it, and continues as if it were installed.

First boot: You'll see a black screen with white DOS display, it counts up the memory, goes to the next screen and displays a system information box, also DOS, then looks for an OS. At that point it will either find your Start Up disk or tell you it finds no OS.

From there, assuming you have a new hard drive, you go into BIOS and set the hard drive parameters, usually autodetect works fine, then boot to the Start Up disk, fdisk, partition and format the drive, reboot to the start up disk again and it should be able to access the drive, and you're ready to install.
Rather than go into full instructions here, check my page posted below, a couple of sites listed have installation instructions, the PC Guide's Partitioning and Formatting Procedure (http://www.pcguide.com/proc/setup/hdd.htm) will help with preparing the disk, and Win95 Installation (http://www.pcguide.com/proc/sw/w95inst.htm) covers installing win95. Win 98 is not much different, except that the Start Up disk allows you to install temporary CD ROM drivers and bypass the CD driver installation step. Trish's Escape From Hardware Hell, accessible from my page, has good instructions for win98, look in the Operating Systems section and This Link (http://www.hardwarehell.com/fdisk.htm) goes directly to the fdisk, format and install article. Check some of the other sites, lots of great info.

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[TVC15]

When you fire up the PC for the first time you get absolutely nothing! What you need to do is obtain a Windows 95/98 boot disk (anybody who has 95/98 will be able to make one for you), then stick it in the floppy drive and power on. (but make sure the bios is set to boot from the floppy first)

From here you can then partition and format the hard drive. (there are articles within the PC guide about how to do that)

Once that is done you can get around to installing your OS. If you have the full version of 95 then you should be able to install it straight away.

Power up the PC with the boot disk in the floppy drive. Select the option to start the PC with CD Rom support. Then change to a C: prompt and type the following:

md win95

Next type:

copy e:\win95\*.* c:\win95

It will then copy all the windows 95 files onto your hard drive. Once its done that, type the following:

cd win95

Then type:

setup

And it will then run through the Windows 95 installation routine.

If you only have the upgrade, however, then you will have to install Windows 3.1 first and then put 95 on top. But if you have Windows 3.1 you will first have to install DOS. Confused? Don't worry, so am I. Better try and obtain a full version of 95 or 98 (through fair means or foul) as this will save you a lot of hassle.

By the way, Windows 2000 is not really aimed at the home market. The true successor to Windows 98 is Windows Millenium, which by all accounts, is not really worth bothering with.

Probably the best OS to aim for is Windows 98 second edition. In the UK I have seen this for as little as £49 (about $90) so if you shop around then you should get a better deal.

Good luck!

Andy

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Up every evening 'bout half eight or nine,

I give my complete attention to a very good friend of mine.

[sleddog]

Originally posted by Paleo Pete:
I would stick with win 98. For most home users win2000 is not really necessary, it's designed more for business and networking use, and I'm not entirely positive they've worked all the bugs out.


Are you implying that all the bugs have been worked out of Windows 98? http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

Windows NT4 is a vastly more stable platform than Windows 95/98, with much better memory management and multitasking abilities. In the 8 days I've used it, Windows 2000 has shown itself to be at least the equal of NT4. I think Windows NT/2000 is for anyone who wants the best Microsoft operating system available.

Bugs in Windows 2000 are addressed by Microsoft through Service Packs (as was the case with NT4). Service Packs are comprehensive updates easily installed on top of the original OS (and available for download from the MS site). The 'Service Pack' concept does not exist for Windows 95/98.


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sleddog
[sleddog.f2s.com] (http://www.sleddog.f2s.com)

[Randy_tx]

Welcome Dan ! Building your first computer is a ADVENTURE to say the least http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif......Before you worry about which operating system you plan to use, I would FIND A GOOD MENTOR ! You will enjoy the experience MUCH more if you have someone who has built a computer BEFORE assisting you in making sure all of the little details are handled correctly. One incorrect jumper or setting done wrong can take HOURS to straighten out. Good luck! The least expensive way to get one of the newer OS's on your computer is to go ahead and put Windows 95 on it and then upgrade to Win 98 SE (about $88 orless if you can find it). Whatever you do ...my advice is JUST DONT LOAD WINDOWS Me http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif.

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"As hard as a rock & dumb as a brick"...Windows CEMeNT

[Fish]

Not trying to get in an argument here Randy,but, are you sure you can upgrade from 95 to 98? I didn't think you could.
Also Dan, does it have to be Windows? You ever think about looking at Linux or BEOS? Just a thought. Good Luck! BTW, there's no stupid questions! If you don't know the answer it's only stupid to not ask and screw things up. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Pretend you see an evil wizard here, this scares you. It is wicked-
This is my avatar. And it makes me happy to have it.

[This message has been edited by Fish (edited 03-24-2001).]

[Randy_tx]

Yes sir.....with a Win 98 Upgrade you sure can......I do it all the time for people....I make them go out and buy the Win98 Upgrade and I install it right on top of Win95.......In fact, you can actually upgrade Win98 First edition to SE using the upgrade as well.

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"As hard as a rock & dumb as a brick"...Windows CEMeNT

[Fish]

I knew you could go from 98 to 98se and se to ME etc. Didn't know you could go from 95 to 98. Thanks for the info. I've yet to go 1 day here w/o learning a few things. Thanks for taking my post the right way too. http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Pretend you see a evil wizard here, this scares you. It is wicked-
This is my avatar. And it makes me happy to have it.

[BigBlue66]

Hey,

I use 98SE at home and NT 4.0 Workstation SP6a at work. I must admit that NT is a very stable OS. However, I don't think I would want to run it at home, but that's just my own opinion. (My opinion is based on my lack of knowledge about NT. We have sys admin people to iron out the problems. If I were more confident about my understanding of the system, I would probably vote for NT)

NT will be a little more difficult to set up, since it's not PNP and uses 16bit, but once that's done, you will seldom see any problems with it.

Cheers,

Big Blue 66



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You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you in a court of law.

[LeeV]

Hi folks,

Yes, you can use the Win98SE upgrade on Windows 95, infact you can use it to upgrade windows 3.1 as well. I've never noticed any limitations untill I saw my first WinMe upgrade CD for Win98 users only, this cost a few dollars less than the Me upgrade for the other versions of windows. If It was free, I might try it!

As far as my experiences Win98SE does pretty good, on most pentium machines I've had around.

Lee V

[Paleo Pete]

sleddogg: Nope, I'm not implying the bugs have all been worked out of any Microsoft OS...and in self defense, I did point out that some of the folks here have used win2000 and liked it pretty well. I wish MS would adopt the service pack idea with 98, it seems to work ok for NT, but I guess we'll have to settle for the update method...

As stated above, NT has long been a more stable OS than 95 or 98, and win2000 should be the same, once they find and release fixes for any bugs that are included. It's built around the NT kernel, and uses the same multitasking/multithreading methods, as well as memory management. Should work, but I'm just not sure it's been around long enough for me to recommend it to a novice.

Fish: Yep, as already pointed out, you can use a 98 upgrade CD to upgrade from win3.x or 95. It can also be used as a full install, as long as you have a copy of the earlier OS to show it during installation.

Dan: I wouldn't load 95 then upgrade, I'd use the 98 CD as a full install and just show it the 95 CD during the install. If you do decide on 2000, I'm not sure if it will work the same, but it seems it should. I would also copy the cab files to the hard drive and install from there rather than from CD.

Since you say you have only loaded an OS once, I'd say Linux is definitely out of the question, from what I've heard most people who use it seem to like it pretty well, but installations are often a nightmare, especially if you're not very familiar with installations in general.

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