Brand New to wireless and Network sharing

[deltabwa]

Hi. I have 2 computers. 1 with XP home and one with Win 98. I am also currently on dial-up and there is no network between the 2 computers. We have to take turns getting onto the internet, each computer has it's own modem.

We are seriously considering going to DSL but I have no idea what to buy or what to do. We also want to be able be on the internet at the same time.

What do I need and what do I need to do.

I THINK i need a router (pretty sure about that one) but don't know what type, and do we need wireless DSL modems for each computer? If so, what kind? What does the phone/DSL company install? I guess I need everything. I don't want to buy it from them since I know they are so much more expensive so I don't know what I will need exactly. One website said I needed an Ethernet cable to go wireless.. but why if it's wireless???

I'm sure missing several key pieces of information for you to give me an answer, but I don't know what they are.

Thanks

[PrntRhd]

Yes you will likely want to get broadband (either DSL or Cable) and you share the connection using a router. You get one DSL or cable modem and share it with that router. Your ISP for the broadband may offer a router, check their sites. The speed of the connection usually supports up to 5 PCs.
Although InternetConnectionSharing is possible using dial-up it, this compounds the slowness of dialup, making the connection at least twice as slow as having one PC on dialup.
In your case you would want one PC to be wired to the router via Ethernet cable but additional PCs can connect via wireless once the connected PC configures the router.

[Whyzman]

Linksys has some informative tutorials on the basics.

http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?c=L_Content_C1&childpagename=US%2FLayout&cid=1114037291160&pagename=Linksys%2FCommon%2FVisitorWrapper

[PrntRhd]

Also be aware DSL service may or may not be available, it is quite dependent on the distance to the phone company's Central Office. If you are a long way from the main switches where DSL equipment is located, they won't offer it to you.

[Whyzman]

Hehe...PrntRhd, did you pick up on the "nowhereville?"

[PrntRhd]

Yep,
I also know about this stuff since I had to deal with being on dialup for 6 months despite living in a city of 130,000 people and yet no broadband was available for my neighborhood. The fact there is a ATT high capacity fiber optics corridor running less than two blocks from me was particularly upsetting.

[deltabwa]

They do offer dial-up here. We will also not do the 2 on at the same time with dial-up which is why we are only doing one at a time now cuz i KNOW it will slow things up forever. We have DSL here, not cable lol How backwards is that lol

So you are saying that both computers can't be wireless?

Will the modem connect to the router or the router to the modem... let's try this again...

I don't know what the phone company will install... if anything.. once they are done, we we don't get the modem from them.... At the phone jack (wall).. what will go next... does the modem get hooked into that, and then the router into the modem, or the router first (to intercept any in/out reception immediately) then the modem to the router?

And the speed of the dsl package that we are considering is 512. Is that horrible? And does that matter?

Or will that tutorial explain all that too me and I just haven't looked at it yet?

Thanks for all your help :-)

[Whyzman]

The wireless landscape is changing as newer hardware combinations are emerging (e.g., modem/router combination) . However, the basics are a modem to connect to the source. A router then plugs into the modem. If the router is wireless, it essentially broadcasts a signal that is picked up by the wireless units in the various computers you want to be able to connect. My Linksys wireless router also allows for 4 direct LAN connections.

In my situation, I have a LAN cable connected directly from my main computer into the Linksys router. The modem is right next to this computer so there would be no reason for me to spend extra for a wireless adapter.

I have a second computer that is connected by a Linksys wireless USB adapter that simply plugs into an available USB port. I also have a wireless Linksys Print Server that handles my HP4500 color laser printer which is in another room.

[edit] Oh, and my son is a gamer who connects using his Nintendo DS which has a built-in wireless adapter...

I would suggest having a look at the tutorial.

[deltabwa]

Thank You. I am having a look, slowly but surely lol It takes awhile to load since it's dial-up lol I think I am getting it tho.

Do you have any recommendations as to which to buy? Which should I stay away from?

[Whyzman]

I'm a Linksys guy...I give their tech-support and A+ rating. :)

[deltabwa]

Thanks Whyz... I am about to ask the stupidest question I ahve ever asked but this girl made a point of telling me I needed this and I thought this would be covered with the roouter and modem, but like I said, she made a major point of telling me this... The DSL girl told me I had to have ethernet on both computers... now... isn't that essentially the router????

[mjc]

And both computers hooked up to it...

[PrntRhd]

The DSL girl told me I had to have ethernet on both computers.
No what you need is an Ethernet port on each PC to connect them with wired, the DSL provider may not advise wireless as they may not support networking.
You have them install DSL to one PC and show it is working, and they leave.

[deltabwa]

Oh Boy, now I am really really confused..... Haved them install it to 1 computer and then they leave and then I will uninstall that and install the router and the other computer? I think I need my computer card taken away now... I feel like an idiot.

[mjc]

Ok, the IPS installer will install the service to one computer. Then consider the job finished. It will be up to you to complete the network setup. Which will mean hooking up the router and any other computers to it. Usually all you do is remove the modem from the computer and plug it into the appropriate jack on the router and the plug the router into the computer, from where you just disconnected the modem (network card...since this will likely be a wired connection), then connect any other wired connections. Then you go through the set up...

At least that is the basics. Think of it as putting a 'splitter' between the modem and your computer...

[deltabwa]

Ok, so I am going to go wireless but let me get this straight. They hook the modem from the jack to the computer (wired). Then leave. Then I unhook the modem and install the router (wired) to the computer. Then connect the modem to the router and then install the other computer? Or is it different setup then using wired?

[mjc]

Yep, that's about right...you wan't to have at least one wired connection to the router, which I usually make to the computer closest to the modem. The rest of the connections could be wired or wireless...

Which router did you settle on?

Knowing that we could give more specific pointers for the set up...

[deltabwa]

Ok, maybe we should do this another way. Let's try this.

I am going to be going wireless. I have 2 computers, 1 has win98, the other is this one with XP 2.

This computer, I beleive has a VIA Rhine II ethernet adapter, and is that, could that be attached the the MB?

The other computer has nothing.

What do I need to buy. I have absolutely nothing so I need everything. I am not purchasing the modem from the DSL place, they have one for $100, I don't know the brand or anything, but I think I can get a better one for a better price or at least comparable. If not, then please say so.

So, what do I need. (Please even tell me the basic stuff such as the ethernet cable, modem, router, all that) Please give me the list I should take to the store. And tell me what is wired and wireless, if it applies.

Thanks

[deltabwa]

I haven't really setted on anything, linksys was recommended and that is prob what I will go with, but I posted before I read your reply so the previous post should say it all. Again, any recommedations on actual products, not jsut brands, would be appreciated.

[classicsoftware]

I have no idea where nowhereville is, but this is what you need to find out from your DSL provider:


Do you provide the DSL modem?
Is the modem free or do I have to purchase?
If I have to purchase is their a rebate?
Do I have to by the modem from you? Do you support other modems, if so what brands.
Does the modem have a built in router?
If the modem has a built in router can I get one with out those capabilites or can it be disabled?
Do you install the modem or modem/router or is it self install?
Is it a direct connection or is ir PPPoE


Now what you on your end is:


An ethernet card in each PC. This can be a PCI card or it can be attached to the motherboard. The way you find out is to go to device Manager and look under Network Adapters
A Cat-5e patch cable to reach from the PC to the router.
A Linksys router like WRT54G (http://shopper.cnet.com/Wireless_G_Broadband_Router/4014-3319_9-20796906.html?tag=ob_210&orderby=210&sort=asc) one


If you cannot run the cable you will need a wireless card like this (http://shopper.cnet.com/Linksys_Dual_Band_Wireless_A_G_PCI_Adapter_WMP55AG _network_adapter/4014-3380_9-30485743.html)

The wireless PCI cards can be almost $90.00 each. The wired version is usually built into most PC's and can be added for $10.00 if not. It depends on how hard it is to run the cable from PC's to the router.

[Whyzman]

I'm trying to remember what I did, but I think I purchased the modem that the ISP had for sale. I did so, because they would stand behind problems with it and it is a tried and true device with their system. Also, I don't think there was really any price difference between theirs and what I could find on the open market...

It is my understanding that most ISPs cover the connections that they install. If you choose to supply your own modem and there are problems...they can check to see that you have signal up to the modem...and then it is your problem since it is your modem... Perhaps, as mjc stated, that they ensure hookup to one computer...I'm assuming that's with your supplied modem or theirs...

Okay, you don't need a router if you're hooked up to only one computer...you need only LAN card to connect from the modem to the computer. As an aside, as far as I know, modems don't provide any hardware firewall protection. That would come from a router.

So, if they hook you up from modem to computer, you would pull the LAN cable from the back of the computer and plug it into the appropriate port on your wireless router. The signal is now being fed into the router. You would then take another LAN cable (provided you have a computer in close proximity to the modem and router setup) and plug into one of the wired ports on the router and then connect once again to your computer's LAN card.

This is the way mine is setup, because it saves me the cost of a wireless adapter for the computer that is close to the router.

The second computer is in another room and for that one I purchased a Linksys USB wireless adapter. It simply plugs into a USB port and is configured to communicate with the router.

As I mentioned, I also have a Linksys wireless print server. This device is capable of handling a parallel printer connection, a USB, or a LAN cable. My HP4500 is an older model that could house a LAN card, but has a default parallel port...which the print server is connected to.

I would check with your ISP for compatability, but I use a model WRT54G Linksys wireless router. My Wireless USB is model WUSB11.

What you would also need to check out is whether your ISP supports networking on your DSL connection.

[edit] I see Classic got it before me. The only thing I see differently is the need for a second LAN card. The USB adapter does not require a LAN card to function...saves a few bucks.

[deltabwa]

Ok guys, thanks so, so, sooo very much!! I will call and find out. I thought I would be better getting my own modem but I see that I was wrong about that too. They did say they covered it for 1 yr.

I will get back to you. Ok, so I need to purchase the router, Cat cable and USB Adapter. As I mentioned before, the XP computer has the VIA card, and it looks to me like it's attached to the MB so I don't need a card, if I understand this correctly.

BTW, I will eventually add my printer to this wireless contraption lol soon as I can figure out the good stuff.

Oh yeah, "nowhereville" is about 2 1/2 southeast of Billings. Population, 400ish

[deltabwa]

Ok, I spoke with the company and Classic, here are the answers to your questions,

The modem they have is a Visionet ADSL router.
The router can be disabled for wireless.
They only install to the jack. So it is a self install.
She had no idea what "direct conenction or PPPoE" was or meant. (neither did I so I couldn't expand on it.

She said she wasn't sure but thought maybe I would need to get a hub because there was only 1 port.... again, I'm clueless and she kinda sounded like maybe she was too.

Also, I was looking at the Linksys WKUSB54GS.... Would that be all I needed to purchase then? Or do I still need that cable from the router to the computer?

[classicsoftware]

Ok, I spoke with the company and Classic, here are the answers to your questions,
She had no idea what "direct conenction or PPPoE" was or meant. (neither did I so I couldn't expand on it.

She said she wasn't sure but thought maybe I would need to get a hub because there was only 1 port.... again, I'm clueless and she kinda sounded like maybe she was too.

You will need to call back and get the answers. They have to know the type of service they are selling.

How far is the PC from the router/modem? A small cable will be included with the router.

We will pick the model later.

[deltabwa]

OK, she said they do not do PPPoE and the model number of the modem is 708EUR, if that makes any difference.

It's a tower PC that site on the the floor and it can be within 10' or so of the router. It's the jack that is far away. and I say "Can Be" because there is a shelf on the desk that I can put it on.

[classicsoftware]

Please read this (http://www.dqusa.com/products/manuals/708_QSG_USB_Router_0913v3.pdf) and print it out.

You will have to get the following:

1) The Linksys wireless router

2) You can get a 10' cable here (http://shopper.cnet.com/10FT_GRAY_CAT5E_PATCH_CABLE_SNAGLESS_MOLDED_350MHZ /4014-3115_9-2792415.html)

or

Get a 25' (http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10248728&SearchEngine=Shopper&SearchTerm=10248728&Type=PE&Category=Comp&Gad=0&dcaid=15889) model.

You will need tech support to set talk you through converting the DSL Modem/router into bridge mode.

Get back to us when you get closer to installation time. In the mean time start ordering your stuff...

[deltabwa]

Ok Classic thanks. SHe said they would convert it to bridge mode before they install it.

Thanks, I will get back to you they said probably 1st wk of July for install but I am, I think, doing to install the router first so I may get back to you for that if I run into problems

Thank you very much.

[classicsoftware]

Give it a whirl....

[deltabwa]

Hi there. Well, they installed the DSL before my equipment got here so I am currenlty on DSL.. YIPPPPEEE lol My equipt came yesterday and I went to install the USB to the 98 computer since my computer has the card built in. Well.. dang that's not gonna work The USB won't work with 98. So I'm gonna have to install it all on my computer (XP) and now how do I link the 98? Or can't I?

[classicsoftware]

You will have to use a regular ethernet card and cable or a wireless card in the 98 pc.

[deltabwa]

Ok, I got all my stuff. I have talked to the ISP and did the bridge thing. She said she thinks it's DHSP, The wireless computer (XP) tells me I am "successfully hooked up to the access point" but not the internet. I am currently back using dial-up until I can get this figured out.

The Win98 computer is the wired computer and It tells me : "The router is not able to connect to the Internet. Try turning off the Cable/DSL Modem OFF and back ON again. Do you want to try again." I have tried this 3 times with the same results.

Any suggestions??

P.S. My Ethernet connections are disabled and I also can't see either computers. (98-XP nor XP-98)

[deltabwa]

Ok, well I'm not sure how but I've got the internet working amd I'm currently using wireless internet :-) and the 98 computer can see the XP but.... XP can't see 98, shoot.. it can't even see itself lol

[Whyzman]

A lot seems to have happened between 10:00AM and 7:00PM :)

Is the 98 able to access the net?

'Tis my understanding that the ability for the computers to interact with each other is a different dealy than their ability to access the router and get on the net...

I think XP can walk you through using a wizard to share files etc. XP's security mindedness would not allow access without special authorization...

[deltabwa]

Yeah lol alot happened, don't ask me what or how lol The router, for the longest time, wouldn't access the net. I repeated the steps multiple times and finally it just worked so... lol Then XP could access the net wired but not wireless.. then finally it all worked.

Yes, it can access the net. I've tried using the Wizard in XP but it won't work. I can't remember at the moment what it was saying but I will retry it and then post back..

[deltabwa]

Well I spoke too soon. Last nite after posting this. My hubby & I both tried to get online and He was unable to access the internet. My computer (XP) said I could connect to the access point but could not find the internet. And for a very long time, I couldn't get online either. Then out of nowhere I was online and the Wireless Monitor STILL said I was not conencted to the internet even though I was browsing. It did disconnect internediately but mostly stayed on. Tonight, the same thing. The 98 computer couldn't get online but I immediately did and the wireless monitor gave me the same story, was connected to the router but not the internet. Then eventually it has changed and says I am successfully connect to the access point and the internet. Any thoughts?

[Rick]

I can answer one thing here.
The order of the units power up has a lot to do with how and when you can access the net.

If you are turning off the modems power.
You should also turn off the router and the other units ( PC's)
Then power them up again in order.
Modem, Router, access point, computers ( Hard wired FIRST) then wireless computer

As for the systems not being able to see each other
You need to have the computers named and a common work group name set on each
the work group name Must Match exactly
To set the compter name and work group name on the XP system
Right click on My computer , then Properties, then the Computer Name tab
It should show the computer and work group names

The 98 system needs to have it's own name and the work group must match
Remember to use the same text case in both
Group1 and group1 are NOT the same in win98
so type them in exactly the same on each system
winXP will show it as GROUP1
But when it was entered it was group1

[deltabwa]

Thanks Rick. I did that before and it didn't seem to matter but I tried it again and left it off a little longer. We are both online now, however, the "Monitor" says "No association with access point" But I am clearly online and not through the dial-up. But it's working that way, I should leave it alone lol

I have another issue now with W98. When you go to shut down, and you click the start button.. it stalls for a minute or so before it comes up. Then when you click sign off, it stalls again.

I also, before I started to type this, tried to go into Network Neighborhood on the W98 and I am still waiting for it to come up.. The light on my wireless is lit and the Wireless light on the router is lit, but again, the monitor says no-go. I imagine that's what's taking the W98 so long since it is still not up yet. (((???))) OK, it finally just came up and it showes the W98 computer. Again, that would be because thew router says no access point right.... But if that is the case.. How come I'm able to be on the internet?

And Both computers have the exact same workgroup name, exact case spelling, and each computer is named differently. As I said before, I was able to see the XP computer thru 98 but I could not see the 98 computer through XP.

[deltabwa]

Ok, this is really getting annoying. I was attempting to "enable" the Wireless connection and I got the blue screen with Error 0xD1. File Name TCPIP.sys. It rebooted and It immediately hooked itself up, unlike the last time. It then it said I had connection with access point and internet. Then, 2 minutes later, it was telling me not conenction to the internet, yet, again, I was able to get online. Now, in the space of writing this message, it has successfully connected again to the internet. However, neither computer sees the other.