Food for thought???

[TopChip7]

If your PC worked perfectly well and did everything you required it to, would you still look to upgrade it?


Why do we look to buy the latest FX-62 CPU for example, when perhaps a 1700+ may be perfectly adequate for what we need?

Sorry to bore you all with this - It just seems that although quite happy with my PC, I sit night after night browsing sites to spend money on upgrades.

Now perhaps it's just me - but I doubt it.


Antec T1050B Case
500w Smart Power 2.0 PSU
Abit KN8 SLI Socket 939
AMD64 3000+ O/C
500Gb SataII Raid0 (2x250Gb) HDD
40Gb Ide HDD
Plextor SA716A/L DVD RW
X-Fi Extreme Music
XFX 7300GS
3 Speed 120mm Fan
1 x 92mm + 3 x 80mm fans


And just as an after thought - If you had my PC what would you upgrade next and why?

[123456]

How much RAM do you have?

[madad2005]

The graphics card would need an upgrade to at least a 7600GS cos I'm a gamer. Depending on how far you pushed the A64, maybe moving to a dual-core A64 s939 would be a possibility if I was doing a lot of work on the pc. The amount of RAM you have is another issue. I'd only get more than a gig if my other options for upgrading were already covered.

[TopChip7]

I have 1 Gb stick of ddr400 - not dual channel.

The problem I see with upgrading is this:

I built this pc around 4 months ago. Then AM2 was released which means to upgrade properly I would not only need to change the motherboard and the cpu but also the ddr too (as you know AM2 uses DDR2).

Now Intel have taken the lead over AMD with the Core 2 Duo the battle of price wars for bang vs bucks is going to kick in if it aint already.

If I buy more memory it would only be worth it if it was say TwinXMS. I would also need to buy 2Gb of it to feel like I had made an upgrade at all.

Now 2Gb of XMS is likely to cost me around £140 approx and if I upgrade say in 12 months time to AM2 or Core 2 Duo the memory I have bought will be of no use to me at all (cus I need DDR2 then).

So perhaps I should not upgrade the guts of the system and just get something like a 7950GX2 graphics card which can be transferred to a new motherboard.

However - LOL - I dont play much games - infact I dont do much at all apart from be enthused about my system and look how much more cash I can spend on it LOL LOL LOL

Any thoughts ???

[saphalline]

DDR prices are rising, and will only continue to do so. Ironically, if you're going to do a RAM upgrade using DDR, now is the time to do it. If you want dual-channel, just get another 1GB stick of RAM that matches your current stick as closely as possible, from a vendor that offers no-hassle returns. And no, you don't need XMS-class RAM. You can OC the CPU without touching the RAM.

Being a gamer, I agree with madad2005 on upgrading the vid card. But that's just us gamers. :D

Being a collector of data, I'd probably also add one of the new perpendicular recording technology hard drives. The 320GB version is sitting pretty at under $100. And as an extension, I would also dump the IDE hard drive to reduce cable clutter inside my case.

After that, I'd consider upgrading to a dual-core CPU within the next 6 months, as Socket 939 prices drop like a rock! AMD slashed prices to match Intel in a dual-core war. May as well take advantage of it.

I disagree with your assessment on the core of your system, however. Just because it's not what I would recommend for a new system now doesn't mean it's obsolete. Far from it! Having the NF4 SLI chipset means you have access to modern PC technologies, such as native SATA 300 and PCIe and 64-bit processing. In what way is that obsolete right now? I've always hated that word when it comes to computer technology. Sure a PIII system is too old to be useful as a main computer these days, and even early P4 systems fall under this category. But what you have right now is a modern platform. It's not too old to be useful. And indeed, as of right now, you are Vista ready! :p The full-on Vista experience, too! DX9 3D interface using the new 64-bit kernel! I see no reason to lament about lost opportunities with DDR2 and the latest CPU's. With SLI and support for up to 4GB of RAM, you are essentially on par with the latest systems, especially considering you don't play games. Get a dual-core CPU in there using dual-channel RAM and there's no way your system will be severely thrashed in non-gaming apps for a long time.

[TopChip7]

:D Hey Thanks Saphalline

All of a sudden I feel so much better about my PC set up.

Being meaning to get rid of the IDE HDD for ages now - your quite right it does clutter up with IDE cables.

Trouble with the DDR is I bought it from scan as "Major" and have no idea who the manufacturer is - however I checked the clock in bios and its 3338. Do you think if I bought another gig of 3338 it would match ok or am I taking a chance?

Got an immediate budget of £300 GBP at the moment - cant see that budget increasing any time soon so can only afford one thing or another - either a 4600X2 + 1Gb DDR or 7900GT + 1Gb DDR and wait for CPU prices to drop further.

I just cant make up my mind - I want both - well actually I'd prefer a 5000X2 + 7950GX2....ahhh day dreaming again.

You know what ur talkin about Saph.... Let you decide for me lol

Incidently - totally off the subject - got my cpu running at 30c with full load playin ghost recon (cpu overclocked from 1.8Ghz to 2.25Ghz) and system temp of 29 - 31c ....... How good is that? :D

[jlreich]

I would go for the the CPU and ram myself. Getting the ram into dual channel mode along with a dual core CPU will really make a huge difference. Running the ram in single channel mode is really holding back your system at this point. ;)

With the way the x2's prices have dropped lately I am starting to drool. :p

Those temps are great. I am running a OC'ed 3000+ myself and have the same range of temps.

[TopChip7]

I would go for the the CPU and ram myself. Getting the ram into dual channel mode along with a dual core CPU will really make a huge difference. Running the ram in single channel mode is really holding back your system at this point. ;)

With the way the x2's prices have dropped lately I am starting to drool. :p

Those temps are great. I am running a OC'ed 3000+ myself and have the same range of temps.

Yep... them prices are falling fast - especially lower end ones - 3800 X2 for just £100 - 4200 X2 for £125 - 4600 X2 for £160. These are half price compared with just 3 months ago.

Any idea how much more i can get out of my 3000+. Stopped when I got 2 worried it would fry - however, if i am gonna change my cpu then i might just push it till it burns lol - aint like i can sell it - there only £49 new now.

[jlreich]

I don't have mine pushed very far at the moment. Only at 2007MHz. I know it can go much farther but the cooling in my case is very poor so I don't want to push the system until I get a new case. Like I said my CPU temp is very low at around low 20's idle and no higher than 33 loaded with the room temp very hot. But it is my system temp that worries me ranging from low 30's into the high 40's. I know it doesn't help at all that my computer room is the hottest and smallest room in the house with three computers crammed in there.

[saphalline]

playin ghost reconOh, so you DO play games! Well then, I'd say you have quite the decision on your hands! The RAM is a given, but do you want a new vid card or dual-core CPU first? Either way is fine. But you'll have to make that decision for yourself. The X2 4600+ is alluring, but you've already got a heavily OC'ed CPU. The vid card would significantly improve your gaming performance, but waiting on that doesn't matter since graphics technology is always improving anyway. Decide that one for yourself. Are you more of a CPU power freak or more of a gamer?

The RAM issue is something else entirely. You will have to take out your stick of RAM and physically inspect it for us. We need to know the chip configuration and the info printed on the module and/or chips. Dual-channel is very picky. You can't just stuff any ol' 1GB stick next to your current one and have it work. Each pair needs to match as closely as possible, which is why they sell dual-channel kits these days.

[TopChip7]

ok.... decision has been made

I have just ordered and paid for the following:

5000+ x2
asus crosshair r.o.g. motherboard
2Gb Corsair TwinX Expert DDR2 6400 C4.4.4.12 EPP

Figured that firstly - I only own one game - Ghost Recon A W

Secondly - If I had to spend money on upgrading DDR then I may as well upgrade to DDR2 and as I am never likely to upgrade DDR2 further than 2Gb I may as well spend the money now - yes.... very expensive £217 for 2Gb but SPD will auto overclock to the max - nice !!!

Of course that required me to get a new motherboard - so I figured if I have just bought best overclocking memory that tells me all the voltage etc on the DDR itself, I may as well get the best motherboard that tells me errors on LED screen at rear of pc... clever.

Now - If I am holding what I consider to be best AM2 motherboard and best memory, why spoil it by purchasing a less than best X2 CPU - obviously having spent all this I couldnt afford FX62 - maybe next year lol

Will have to wait 12 months now to get a 7900GTX or 7950GX2 (or a new model by then ;o)

QUESTION: Anyone got one of these Asus Crosshair Motherboards - comes with own sound card so wondering whether to sell my X-Fi Extreme Music Card - any thoughts appreciated.


New System - and I'm quite proud of it so PLEASE DONT SLATE IT lol

Antec T1050B Case
Antec SP 500W PSU Modular
Asus Crosshair R.O.G. Motherboard
AMD 5000+ AM2
2Gb Corsair Expert DDR2 800 C4.4.4.12
X-Fi Extreme Music (Plugged into 500watt hi-fi)
Plextor SA716A/L DVD RW
2 x 250Gb SATA300 HDDs Raid 0
XFX 7300GS 512mb Turbo Cache
Media Centre 2005 Edition
19" GNR TFT

[saphalline]

I'm quite certain no one else here has that mobo yet. :rolleyes: :p A bit too expensive for my tastes.

No, don't sell your X-Fi. As good as the onboard audio is on that mobo vs standard onboard audio, I doubt it can match the pure power of the 10k MIPs on the X-Fi audio processor. I mean, we're talking about a sound card so powerful that the chip on it requires a heatsink! :eek: Nothing built into a mobo can yet match that.

So you went with a totally new system using the NF 590 SLI system with EPP/SLI RAM, huh? A bit overboard, don't you think? Ah well, if it makes you happy. Just be sure to send me your old hardware. ;)

[mjc]

No, don't sell your X-Fi. As good as the onboard audio is on that mobo vs standard onboard audio, I doubt it can match the pure power of the 10k MIPs on the X-Fi audio processor. I mean, we're talking about a sound card so powerful that the chip on it requires a heatsink! :eek: Nothing built into a mobo can yet match that.


Yeah, that means it is more powerful than many late 80s/early 90s computers (286, 386, 486)...heck, it probably even beats out some early Pentium models, too.

And I am really happy with my Audigy card...the first one, not an Audigy 2.

[azzey]

I hate seeing hardware go to waste. Whenever I replace a computer, I don't have it in my heart to get rid of it or sell it, so I end up with a new computer and an old computer anyways. I ask so much out of my computers, and spend so much time on here that it's almost like I have a weird bond with it. And I feel guilty when I buy something new and replace something old... weird, eh?

[TopChip7]

mmm.... THAT'S IT - EUREKA !

I'll sell my 3000+, my KN8 SLi, my old 1Gb DDR & my 7300GS, my scanner, printer, television & vacuum cleaner - throw in the kitchen sink and I'll be able to buy a 7950GX2 - lol

Trouble is, if you dont get rid of them you end up with 50 PCs networked all round the house or at very least boxes and boxes of useless bits lying around everywhere - And if you dont sell the stuff for a few bucks today it will be worth even less tomorrow. Still got a 1700+ (the one I replaced 3 months ago) but cant sell it - aint worth £20. Awww my 1700+..... I loved that pc, done me for a good 5 years.


Re: Onboard sound for the Crosshair - It's actually not onboard - It comes with a 24bit 192Khz PCI Soundcard. Trouble with the X-Fi XMusic is that without an I/O I cant connect front headers so switching from speakers to headphones is a nightmare - although it looks like there is a pin configuration and I've taken a look at some online details but blimey I think I would need to be a rocket scientist to make head or tail of them :confused: lol

UNLESS SOMEONE KNOWS BETTER? :D

[Sylvander]

If you're looking for a good home for your 1700+ I'll be delighted to have it. :D

Probably a lot better than the old thing I have here. :(

[TopChip7]

Gave it to the kids to do their homework on - or otherwise I actually would have let you have it - honestly (you'd have had to pay the postage though lol)

Some things I actually wish I'd kept - I gave away a HP Celeron 800 pc when I bought my 1700+ - Then remembered I'd put a £250 SCSI Card in it with a top of the range CD-RW which cost me another £100 - CDRW has come down to £15 or so, but the SCSI aint come down at all - DOH !!!

[saphalline]

Inventory management is certainly a problem. Right now, I've got my old core available. P4C 2.6 (with HSF unit), i865PE mobo, and 2 x 512MB sticks of DDR333 (which I can't use for a modern gaming system). So I'm stuck with just these 4 pieces for now. Don't have enough higher caliber parts to complete it into a useful machine, and it's just sitting here doing nothing.

I'd probably sell the whole kit for $100 as of right now. It isn't worth any more than that since it's used and doesn't have PCIe.

[mjc]

I'd almost take you up on it if my wife wouldn't skin me alive for gathering more 'parts'...

[saphalline]

That's why I'm trying to get rid of parts! I also have a couple Socket A parts if you're interested... :D