Which Celeron 800 / Motherboard Combo?

[mikej]

Hi All,

I found this PC Guide site and forum and have been glued to the screen every spare minute for a night and a day, now. What a resource! The value of this place is not wasted on me; I’ve been looking for PC info, and have obviously come to the right place!

Anyway, this is my first post and I would like to ask some advice concerning my plan to assemble a PC to fill the need created when someone broke into my home and stole my last PC, a Gateway PII, 233 Mhz machine w/192 MB RAM. I was left with my monitor, a CDRW I hadn’t had time to install yet (thankfully), an old extra keyboard, and my software (Win98 and etc.) My friend has offered me an old tower case w/power supply, an old 2 GB hard drive and a cheap mouse from his storage shed. I have a floppy drive from an old 386.

I took a pretty big hit when the thieving parasites cleaned me out and so I am looking to get back into a PC on the cheap, with an eye to upgrade as I can. Probably upgrade the hard drive first.

My PC needs are fairly meager: Web, Word 97, Access 97, Excel 97 and I study VB6 and Visual Interdev6 (Visual Studio 6, Enterprise Edition). No games. My old PII machine used to strain a little modifying images with MS Photodraw 2000, but it worked, mostly.

My questions:


Since I have the case, monitor, CDRW, hard drive, keyboard, floppy drive, mouse and software, it seems to make sense to build an 800 Mhz box rather than get a used, slower one out of the paper for a few hundred bucks. Yes?

Maybe I’ll build the system around the Celeron 800 CPU. It seems like a good choice because it is the lowest in that economy line with a 100 Mhz system bus. Is this correct factually, and/or sound reasoning? Any other suggestions? Maybe get an Athlon XP 1700 / mobo combo next year…

Video and sound on the mobo may not be the best, but it sure sounds economical in the short run. I’d rather drive a jalopy than walk… The PC Guide counsels to get quality components. PriceWatch.com lists four pages of Celeron 800 / mobo combos, priced $92 to $192 here (http://www.pricewatch.com/1/306/2421-1.htm). What criteria can I use to decide which is the best choice for my needs, economy being the watchword for now?

Can anyone recommend (or warn against) a particular chipset or brand or exact model?


Please be brutally honest regarding my ideas as I value any opinion or advice FWIW; I read somewhere that “A man should not mince words to spare the sensibilities of the thin-skinned or the ignorant.” ;-)

As a newbie to this forum, I would like to express my thanks to you all for the info I’ve already gleaned here and I look forward to learning more so as to be in a position to pay it forward to others down the line.

Best Regards,
Mike

[JadedC36]

Mikej;
You will need to know what "form factor" the case can handle. If it too old, it may only take 'AT' style boards, and they are getting hard to find, also the power supply is specific to a form factor. Some of those combo's listed in your link were "microATX" which also may not fit into the case you are planning to use. I'm sorry that I can't validate the fsb for the 800 Celeron, I just haven't paid attention to them. If it is a 100 fsb, I would recommend the i815 chipset (can be found w/onboard video, and sound), and nearly every mobo maker has one. I'm sure that the AMD people in this forum will come up with a better combination for you than the Celeron. One point, if you still decide to go with the Celeron, I would recommend the i815E chipset (socket 370) so you could upgrade to PIII. I believe that DDR-SDRAM would be a wiser choice, and right now the most economical combo is with an AMD cpu.

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Mike

[BigBlue66]

Hey Mike,

Check this site out. May be more worthwhile and it will be upgradeable.
http://www.computersurplusoutlet.com/viewproduct.asp?ProductID=COM-750NHD

I have bought a lot of components from this place, as well as two systems like the one I'm pointing you to here. Granted, it's not top of the line, but it will do the job for you and you can upgrade the processor and memory later on. That system should come with a 300watt power supply. Go take a look.

Edit: In fact, I'm typing this on one just like it, except I have upgraded the memory and processor. It's rock solid stable.

Cheers,

Big Blue 66


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This space reserved for highly intelligent observations and witty remarks.

[This message has been edited by BigBlue66 (edited 12-31-2001).]

[kenja]

Hello Mike,

Some thoughts:

Are the keyboard and mouse PS/2, or the older AT style? Adapters are available, and a serial mouse will work with an ATX (PS/2) motherboard.
PS/2 keyboards and mice can be found cheaply on the web; this is the least of your decisions.

Is the old floppy 1.44MB? I'm not sure how useful a 720KB one would be.

As JadedC36 points out, you really need an ATX style of case/power supply.

For the absolute lowest cost using new components, I'd get a 366MHz Celeron (check Pricewatch.com) and a discontinued motherboard that has a jumper for 100MHz FSB. (I've got 815 and VIA Apollo Pro 133A mobos that do this, and both are Pentium compatible. You need to check the manufacturer's specs to see exactly which CPUs are supported on which mobos.) I've got two machines running at 550MHz with this method; totally stable, and surprisingly low CPU temps (as long as the heatsink fan is plugged in http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif.)

You are correct, the 800MHz Celeron is the first one with the 100MHz FSB by default.

Pentiums are sooo expensive compared to AMDs; I really don't consider them to be a good upgrade.

My recommended system for your needs, with upgradability:

The Enermax CS-A1QX case (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=7&manufactory=1400&DEPA=1). I've got one; the power supply is the same as the model on the AMD recommended list (http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/TechnicalResources/0,,30_182_869_1039,00.html), except with a single ball-bearing fan. The power supply is better than the case; I dislike not having direct airflow over the hard drive(s).

For the mobo, I'd get the ECS K7S5A (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=22&manufactory=1414&DEPA=1). This is upgradable to the AMD XP CPUs and DDR memory. I've had good luck with Newegg's "refurb" motherboards (actually returns and discontinueds), but the ones with the KT133A chipsets sell for as much as the ECS does.

For now, I'd get a retail box 950MHz Duron (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=225&manufactory=1028&DEPA=1) (comes with HSF (same as a CoolerMaster heatsink) and a three-year manufacturer's warranty).

A drawback of the ECS mobo: only two (not three) usable memory slots. It gives the choice of either SDRAM of DDR, however. For your needs, a 256MB SDRAM DIMM (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=148&manufactory=1183&DEPA=1) would be fine. Tough choice, though, because if I got an XP in the future, I'd want DDR memory (maybe a 10% advantage). (Memory prices have spiked upward for no good reason lately, I'm "sure" they'll come back down by summer.)

You've got a CDRW, so you don't need a CD-ROM. Used to be a concern about using a CDRW for everyday needs, but they've come down in price to "commodity" levels.

Edit: mmm, for some reason I was thinking the ECS had onboard video. Good 2D cards for the money are the ATI Xperts (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=48&manufactory=1126&DEPA=1). (Watch out for "Powered by ATI" video boards. These have the ATI chip, but are made by hole-in-the-wall manufacturers. ATI drivers may or may not work with these.)

At 32MB, equally good is the Nvidia TNT2 M64 (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=48&manufactory=1314&DEPA=1) (with a reputation for better driver support than ATI).


[This message has been edited by kenja (edited 12-31-2001).]

[kenja]

A "bottom dollar" system (limited upgradability):

Refurb microATX case from Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=7&manufactory=1231&Type=Refurbish): $35, delivered. (Three available.)

Epox socket 370 mATX mobo from Compgeeks (http://www.compgeeks.com/details.asp?invtid=3VBM),
Celeron 433MHz (http://www.compgeeks.com/details.asp?invtid=FV524RX433-N); mobo + CPU delivered price: $60.

Heatsink/fan: Cooler Master DP5-6H51 (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=62&manufactory=1333&DEPA=1), 128MB memory (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=148&manufactory=1183&DEPA=1) (I think this Epox only handles 128MB/slot.) and 16MB ATI (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=48&manufactory=1126&DEPA=1) from Newegg, $67.83 delivered. (I think the 16MB is worth the few dollars more than the 8MB ATI).
If you need a 1.44MB floppy, Newegg has great prices on these. (Shipping prices are reduced after the second item, except in the refurb dept.)

[kenja]

The mATX Enlight (http://www.enlightcorp.com/main_frame.html) case has the power supply mounted parallel to the CPU. To be sure there is plenty of clearance, get the Cooler Master DP5-5G11A.

[steveo]

I'll throw in as well.

Over xmas I built a celeron pc for myself so here goes.

I put a coppermine celeron 900 on a gigabyte cvxc7-4xp mobo fueled with 256 sdram. Add to that a off the shelf atx tower with 300w ps.

I used my old rage xpert agp 2x video card, 8x creative cdrom, SB 32 and conexant soft 56k modem. O/S is win98se.

So far the pc works like a dream. No hardware/driver/software problems at all and the mobo was simple to set up. No troubles with the bios either. In light of todays hardware it's hardly up to the standards alongside the heavyweights but this pc handles my needs easily and I'm getting more headache free bang for the bucks I spent, which was about 450 canadian after tax.



[This message has been edited by steveo (edited 01-07-2002).]