AMD v Pentium 4

[merrybo]

Hi,
I,m new to this forum and I hope you can help me.
I want to buy a new pc and I have two under consideration. One has an AMD Athlon 1670 mhz processor,GeForce 4 MX420 graphics card and a firewire port;the other one has a Pentium 4 processor,GeForce 4 (?),Card shared with RAM and no firewire.Bearing in mind that my use is graphics processing using Photoshop 6.0,which is the better buy? Both are about the same price.
Thanks for your help.
Cheers,
Anne (in rainy London,UK) http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/cool.gif

[Rick]

When working with Photo you are dealing with 2D not 3D and the new G4 video cards are designed for performance in 3D .
Their 2D performance is not that great.

Also you will find using shared memory video card and large Graphics will also suffer in video performance.


You don’t give the processor speed of the P4
Working with Photo the amount of Free Memory and CPU speed will make a major difference
Also you don’t list the Operating system. Win2K and Photo perform well together .
WinXP and Photo have a few issues . For Example . Text added to Graphics in Photo suffers from Lag . ( Type to screen display)

If these two systems are Both integrated video ( On Board) Check for an available AGP slot so you can install a better Card as needed

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DEAR IRS
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[saphalline]

I agree with Rick, any G4 MX card isn't the best for Photoshop work. Also, any G4 card (in a P4 system) is a stand-alone AGP card, not any of that "shared with RAM" crap so I wonder if the advertisement was written by a moron? Also, you'll probably want firewire and USB 2.0 ports in your computer, for transfering images to/from various digital and/or DV cameras. Digital cams use USB, DV cams use firewire. Actually, I guess it's up to you which one you need more, but expansion cards can be added at any time so it's really no biggie.

Given your requirements, I'd say either of those systems would be a bit disappointing in one way or another. Keep shopping around, and maybe some of our board members from the UK will be able to point you to a good European vendor. I know you have to pay more over there http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif.


Doh! I forgot to tell you, Photoshop would look nicer with a Radeon 7500 graphics card, or a Matrox G400, G450, or G550. Matrox cards are excellent for 2D but are rarely sold in home PC's. You'll have to buy one and install it yourself if you want a Matrox card.

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Windows 95: A 32-bit extension of a 16-bit overlay for an 8-bit OS that was originally designed for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company that can't produce 1 bit of good software!

[This message has been edited by saphalline (edited 04-30-2002).]

[merrybo]

Hi guys,
Thanks for the replies.

Rick, the Pentium is 2.0GHz and the OS is WinXP on both machines.

Saphalline,I,d be prepared to install a new graphics card.Of the two you mentioned, which would you recommend?

Both machines are quite cheap (considering this IS rip-off Britain http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif ) so I,d like to buy one then upgrade components as neccessary.

Thanks for your advice,
Cheers,
Anne

[Rick]

You will suffer with the text lag in XP on both systems. using Photo6
I’m not sure if this has been addressed in Photo7

The AMD 1900+ running at 1670 and the P4 at 2.0 should both give you good performance.
With the P4 having a small edge.

I Agree with sophalline on the video card selection.
I have both the G400 and the newer G450.
In My systems the Older G400 out performs the Newer card,( G450)
With Both running on AMD based systems.
here is a link to Matrox GB http://shopmatrox.com/europe/home.asp?currencyid=3&cid=224

The G400 32meg is the card I prefer.. Or the G400 Max


[This message has been edited by Rick (edited 04-30-2002).]

[kfh]

Hi merrybo,
These places are a good place to look to compair priecs.
www.dealtime.co.uk (http://www.dealtime.co.uk) www.pcindex.co.uk (http://www.pcindex.co.uk)

kfh.
http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif


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Sequitur Patrem Non Passibus Aequis

[saphalline]

Originally posted by merrybo:
Hi guys,
Thanks for the replies.

Rick, the Pentium is 2.0GHz and the OS is WinXP on both machines.

Saphalline,I,d be prepared to install a new graphics card.Of the two you mentioned, which would you recommend?

Both machines are quite cheap (considering this IS rip-off Britain http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif ) so I,d like to buy one then upgrade components as neccessary.

Thanks for your advice,
Cheers,
Anne

I guess I'd go with the 32MB G400 as Rick suggests, I've never actually seen the newer Matrox cards in action and he has. Last one I saw was the G300 or 350, can't quite remember, but I do remember that it produced good visuals (no flicker) while also sucking at games http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif.

It still amazes me today that in fact 2D and 3D excellence can't be found on the same frickin' graphics card! It's been that way ever since the original Voodoo pass-thru card made its debut! I think ATI and NVidia (mostly NVidia) need to wake up to 2D. Maybe what's really needed is separate 2D and 3D chips? Ok, enough ranting...

If you're interested in upgrading, then that P4 machine looks to be the best. And if you're still thinking about USB 2.0 and firewire, then Adaptec makes a PCI expansion card called the DuoConnect (US $130) which features 4 USB 2.0 ports and 2 firewire ports in one card. Excellent price per port, though I don't know what it'll cost you in "rip-off Britain".

One more essential point: what size monitors do those computer systems come with? If they don't come with a monitor (or have the option of not taking the one that comes with them) then you should definitely consider a 19" CRT monitor (or larger). 15" and 17" monitors can't quite reach productivity-enhancing resolutions (1280 x 960 minimum). I've used smaller monitors, of course, but I never realized how much easier it is to get things done until I got myself a 19"! I spend a lot less time "Alt-Tabbing" to different windows and I can now arrange my windows vertically without having to scroll sideways. The extra screen realestate is certainly a plus and I would never go back to anything smaller again.

If you can't afford a 19" monitor (or the systems come with a 17" one) you aren't any worse off because all those Matrox cards I listed before feature multi-monitor support. Basically you can attach an extra 17" monitor and have two monitors for twice the visual space! Either way you go, having more display area is a tremendous boost to productivity, and would probably benefit your Photoshop experience more than most other upgrades.

Don't forget that you may need to upgrade the RAM, also. Rick mentioned this before, and I've seen benchmarks on Photoshop and RAM usage that would make you cringe. Photoshop actually benefits from more RAM all the way up to 1GB, and probably more! I'm guessing that P4 system only comes with 256MB. If so, there's another upgrade that will speed Photoshop. And with Win XP's max RAM usage of 4GB, you can keep adding RAM 'till you run out of money and not have to worry about it going to waste. Go for at least 512MB, or add 512MB to the (assumed) 256MB that comes with the computer for a total of 768MB of RAM, which is quite substantial by today's standards and should keep Photoshop happier on those large files.

So let's recap these upgrades to your new computer http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif by price: Matrox G400 32MB version is your best bet for a graphics card, at least 512MB of RAM, a 19" monitor is nice, two 17" monitors would actually be better, then if you still have money left over, consider going up to 768MB or 1024MB (1GB) of RAM. If you think you'll need it, also throw in Adaptec's DuoConnect somewhere in your upgrading, but this can certainly be forgotten if you don't have or intend to own any digital or DV cameras.

I hope you have deep pockets!

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Windows 95: A 32-bit extension of a 16-bit overlay for an 8-bit OS that was originally designed for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company that can't produce 1 bit of good software!

[This message has been edited by saphalline (edited 04-30-2002).]

[merrybo]

Thanks Rick,I,ll Check out the Matrox cards.I remember I had a Matrox card in a previous pc,it was a budjet card but did the job.
Cheers,
Anne

[merrybo]

Originally posted by kfh:
Hi merrybo,
These places are a good place to look to compair priecs.
www.dealtime.co.uk (http://www.dealtime.co.uk) www.pcindex.co.uk (http://www.pcindex.co.uk)

kfh.
http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif



Thanks,kfh,I,ll check out these links.
Cheers,
Anne

[merrybo]

Hi Saphalline,
Thanks for your detailed reply http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif
Both machines come without monitors,which suits me fine as I already have a good 17" Mitsubishi,and yes,I am planning to get a second monitor,19" (great minds think alike http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif trying to work on an image with PS menus in the way drives me crazy!I know PS LOVES ram so thats on the list too. I do have a digicam and plan to get a DSLR later this year so I think a firewire port will be essential-sigh- the 'digital darkroom' sure is expensive!Sometimes I think I should just ditch this photography lark and take up knitting http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif I,m sure my bank manager wishes I would!
Anyway,thanks for your great advice,
Cheers,
Anne (and its still raining http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/frown.gif )

[BigBlue66]

I use the G450 dual monitor card at work on a P4 system with 2000Pro. The 2D graphics are exceptionally crisp and clear.

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This space reserved for highly intelligent observations and witty remarks.

This message has not been edited by BigBlue66.

[pcmuncher]

The last place to look is here (http://www.yorkshirecomputers.co.uk) only components in the UK that are worth buying. These guys have been doing computers since the ZX81!!
This is my favourite motherboard in the UK at the moment, not only because of it's price.
If you want a effectively priced machine, start with these:
http://websell.pipex.com/beta-cgi/tek/0100162.html
stick one of these on too http://websell.pipex.com/beta-cgi/tek/0202041.html

Happy shopping.

:p

[onionring]

oops.i am in the usa....;)