WiFi Bridge questions...

[Budfred]

Howdy...

A wireless internet service is coming to my town and it says that it will require a "wifi bridge" to work... They are offering to rent the bridge for $5 a month, but I will almost certainly want to buy one... I have a couple of questions about it though...

1. How is a bridge different from a wireless router?

2. What would be some of the best alternatives for a bridge? I would want one that would be able to pick up the fastest speeds they will offer and I would want good security...

This is the level of access I am looking at:

Deluxe Broadband - Perfect for the small or home office

* Remove the upload bottleneck of cable modems
* 2.5 - 3 Mbps data rate for upload and download
* Up to 60 times faster than dial-up
* Upload 6 - 15 times faster than cable modem
* Always on connection - free up your telephone line
* 10 email addresses with 100 MB of storage per address
* Spam and virus protection for e-mail
* $29.99 per month, plus the optional recommended wireless bridge ($5 per month lease or purchase)
* May not be available in certain areas


Third question is whether there are other questions I need to ask, but don't know...

Thanks for any ideas...

[Variable]

A bridge won't have any security to speak of, it is a dumb device to pass traffic from one medium to another. 802.11 devices are regulated by the gub'ment so just about any name brand will have the same power rating. All that I have seen will go up to the max power allowed. This is not necessary however, increase in gain imparts increase in transmission AND reception which, equates to more noise. Noise is bad for wireless. If you want to get the most out of the device I would look at buying better antenna's to go on it. The radio's (thats what wireless routers are) come with cheap antenna's. I would buy a recommended bridge and upgrade the antenna's. You probably already have a router, so you would get a wireless bridge and plug it into a router for security. Where you mount it will matter as well, if you want to be a savvy user you can buy a nice exterior antenna and then run it to your bridge. Now if they are doing 2.4Ghz and you happened to have a wireless 2.4 router... you may look into buying a powered antenna mounting it outside and running the line to the routers antenna lead, distance matters here shorter is better. Think old style TV, the broadband is the TV channels and you are trying to get the best reception on your TV set (router). Indoor antennas may work fine but one stuck outside is better. Same deal, different decade. Once the connection is made i would do my security on my router. I like a separate device.

We do encrypted wireless broadband to clients where I work, I set up a great deal of it so I am familar with it, a lot of companies give you a pipe to the net with no security. Sounds like these folks do that. Be advised VOIP can have issues with wireless, Noise will drop packets... Encryption causes latency and latency drops packets...

[bassman]

I'm still a little curious in this one .?.
What exactly is the "Bridge" doing in this? I am assuming to receive this service, you use some kind if decoder device much like a cable/DSL modem. If they don't have this, then they either assign MAC/IP addresses (yours) for billing, or it is freely broadcast. Any antanna can pick this up and be piped into your network via your wireless router. Again, I don't see what the bridge is doing.
I am not denying it is needed, I am just curious how it is used.

[johnny_quest]

they said the bridge was optional and "recommended", it's probably just for improved reception, i.e. picking up the signal on the roof and rebroadcasting it into your home, or just a way to make a few more bucks a month off of you.

all you should need is your wireless cards and some client software which gives you your paid access. that's how it's done on college campuses and such.

[Budfred]

The only thing that is optional is whether you rent it from them or buy it... They are very clear that a bridge is needed...

I believe access is controlled through passwords like on other ISPs... No one can log into the system unless they have an authorized password...

[classicsoftware]

That seems like a steep price. I pay $45.00 a month but I get 8 mbs download and soon it will be going to 16......

[Budfred]

That seems like a steep price. I pay $45.00 a month but I get 8 mbs download and soon it will be going to 16......

I am pretty sure that is the fastest speed available in this area and it is about the best price... Right now I get the slowest DSL service for $15/month and my ISP is another $10 a month, so this would be only $5 more for much faster service....

[classicsoftware]

If there is no cable there, go for it.

[Budfred]

I just looked at it again... Cable does seem to be faster and I can match this speed for just a bit more cost... I will look into that further...

[bassman]

Third question is whether there are other questions I need to ask, but don't know...
Is the $30 a teaser rate? If so, how long does it last? What is the regular rate after?
Comcast is the local big cable company here and the combined cost (teaser+regular) for a year is absolutely ridiculous.
Do they allow multiple computers at this price?
I believe that rule is a thing of the past, but you might want to ask.
* $29.99 per month, plus the optional recommended wireless bridge ($5 per month lease or purchase)
I would be asking them to explain exactly what this wireless bridge does. My understanding of a bridge is, basically it adds more connections to a wired system, they can be used to control flow of traffic in a multi-branched network, and they can be used to ad distance. A wireless bridge therefore seems, pointless.?.
It may be a circumstance of verbiage but I would want a clear explanation of exactly what their wireless bridge does. Variable? You seem to be very knowledgeable on this. Do you know what they are requiring this for?

A little Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_networking_device) for our review.

[Budfred]

The plan is owned and regulated by the city, so the prices are expected to remain pretty stable... This town has already been burnt by the cable company jacking up prices and cutting back services after getting established, so they are being careful to maintain control of the wireless system...

I did call and talk to the rep at the company that provides the wireless and he indicated that the bridge may not be absolutely essential if the signal in your area is strong enough, but that for most homes it will be needed... Laptops may be able to use internal wifi receivers to connect, but that is less likely from within buildings...

At this point, as classicsoftware suggested, I am looking into cable again and may go that way... I was thinking the cable was actually slower, but it is not... I have been thinking about getting basic cable for TV anyway.... :D

[jlreich]

I would go with cable. The perhaps look into the city wireless later after it has been up and running for awhile. Then you can ask around and get feedback from those that are using it. Cable internet service is usually from month to month, so you won't be locked in to a contract and can switch to the wireless at any time if you find it is a good deal later on.

Wireless is convenient, but anything coming over a wire is more reliable and generally faster.

The one thing that interest me about the wireless is if you would be able to use it anywhere in the city on your laptop. Say if you decided to go to the park, or wherever. :cool:

My city is supposed to be working on city wide wireless internet right now as well. I will be looking into it when it comes around, but I am not about to give up my cable internet unless it looks really good. Perhaps if they will offer a low rate connection for cheap I might get it as a secondary service just to have internet anywhere I go, but keep my cable internet for home.

[Budfred]

The city-wide service would allow you to log in anywhere once you have an account... Of course, if you stray outside the boundaries, you are dropped immediately...

I am tending towards the cable... I can get it right now, it is faster and it won't cost that much more... I am planning to get basic cable so I get a clearer picture on TV anyway, so this would be a good time to do it... The net outcome is that I am going to get rid of my land telephone and that will save me more than the cable service with internet and TV will cost me... I am checking with Circuit City tomorrow about getting the modem for free after rebate...

[jlreich]

Another thing, I think someone mentioned it already, is how many computers are you going to be allowed to have connected at one time? There has to be some kind of limit. If not you could share your service with whomever you wanted to. :eek:

[bassman]

I am checking with Circuit City tomorrow about getting the modem for free after rebate...
This is something I always found curious. people buying their cable/DSL modem from a retailer. Don't these companies supply a modem with the service???? I have AT&T DSL at home and my father had Mediacom cable. Both of which supply and are responsible for the modem.
I know there was some talk about this a while back where some companies did not supply or people felt they get better service with an aftermarket modem. Is this still the case?

[mjc]

I have AT&T DSL at home and my father had Mediacom cable.

Over here, most of the companies that 'provide' a modem use the cheapest/least features base model around. And they usually charge a couple of bucks a month for it...(one service I looked into that I couldn't get was $5/cheaper bringing your own modem)...

[Budfred]

That is the case and also Circuit City has a deal to get the service for $20 a month for 6 months and to include a $75 gift card with the deal in addition to the free (after rebate) modem, so it does seem worthwhile to me...

For the wireless service that the town is offering, I believe it can be used by anyone who has your log-in info, but the contract says that you are responsible for protecting that and misuse can get you dropped... I imagine some abuse will be possible and will happen, but the city-wide internet service already exists in some place and will soon be the norm all over this metro area... Unfortunately, the other city and town bordering my town are going with a different service... Not a smart move on my town's part since seamless service all over the metro would be a major selling point...

[Budfred]

I picked up the self install package for Comcast at Circuit City and it comes with a software package that requires that I turn off my antivirus and firewall to install it... Obviously, I am not comfortable with that and view it as a stupid requirement... My question is whether anyone knows if I can set it up without the software package?? Also, if it does require the software package, how do you set it up in Linux??

[classicsoftware]

When you set Comcast up for the first time, you are only on-line with them. I would have NO problem going on without worry about getting infected. If you have a router, you will need to call tech support and they will talk you through the setup.

[Budfred]

An update:

I got Comcast installed and used a self-install kit from Circuit City to set up the internet... They didn't get it together until I called and walked through it on the phone and then the connection was unstable... Now it has been out of commission for most of the last 24 hours and the solution they offered me was to take time off to wait for a tech to come by and check the connection... They will charge me $20 for that privilege... Oddly, right now it appears that the connection is working again, but I don't know if I trust it enough to rely on it... I am on DSL right now since I didn't stop that yet... I was gone for the last week, so I don't know how the connection did during that time, but I suspect it wasn't stable... I am going to try them at Tech support one more time and ask to speak to a supervisor... If they can't get it together, I will probably go with the city wifi option instead...

Oops, the connection is gone again....

As for their support... I tried email, but got only a canned response... To use email or chat, you have to fill in a form on an unsecured site giving your name, address, email address and phone number just to get access... They don't seem to think that security needs to be a concern for their customers... I tried the chat to see about SPAM I started getting almost immediately and the guy simply stated to drop my email account and then hung up on me... I tried again and got the same guy... I post: "You hung up on me" and he hung up again... The guy on the phone mostly seemed to be interested in getting me off the phone as quickly as possible... I am really NOT impressed...

[classicsoftware]

How is your DSL hooked UP?

Do you have a router?

If you need to contact Comcast again, ask for Level 2 support. And get the name and ID number of everyone you speak to. I have always had decent service from them....

[Budfred]

My router died a few months ago and I haven't replaced it... I just have the ethernet cable plugged into the DSL modem when I am using it... I decided to try power cycling the cable modem again and it worked this time, so I plugged the cable into it and it is working now... I was going to call and ask to speak to a supervisor if it didn't work, so I am holding off for now...

The thing that has bugged me the most is the general rudeness of the service at Comcast... When I called to order it, I was told I had never had cable service in this house and when I asked why it is that I have cable outlets installed, she said that a lot of houses are built that way... When I indicated that it seemed unlikely in a house built in 1938, she just repeated that I had never had service... The installer was surprised to find that I did indeed already have cabling to the house and that he only had to install 1 outlet where I hadn't had one previously... Then the experience with the irrelevant email response, the unsecured information to even access email/chat and the jerk who hung up on me twice in chat just made it worse... The uselessness of the last person I talked to was only rude in that he clearly wasn't really interested in helping me solve the problem and wanted to get me off the line, but at least he wasn't as intentionally rude as the others... I see a lot of stuff about idiot users calling tech support, but I am pretty well informed and find most tech support to be useless and arrogant...

I'll let you know if things change again, I will not be surprised if they do...

[jlreich]

Budfred, you have the worst luck with technology and the resulting support. All the problems you had with your new build last year and the support from Asus and Newegg, and now this. :eek:

I hope you get it sorted out.

[classicsoftware]

If your DSL is PPPoE, with a user name and password and you have software that works the modem, this software can interfere with your cable connection.

Check your IP address when things get flaky....

[Budfred]

I am pretty sure that I just plugged the modem in and went online when I set up this computer... I messed around with some settings in the router for security when I was using it, but this is just the modem now... Also, the cable modem is not even picking up a signal when it is not working, even when it is not connected to the computer... When it picked up the signal and I plugged in the computer, it worked fine...

I think the reason I have so much trouble with the service is that I expect to actually get answers and I get angry when I get marketing and FAQs instead... They always seem to assume that you have done nothing to investigate the problem and you don't know anything about computers... When I encounter one that gives me credit for having a brain, I am grateful and feel very positive about the product... Unfortunately, that is a rare event... The guy that installed the cable was pretty good, but I was already angry at Comcast for the hassles in just getting set up to start... Then things went downhill from the install...

At this point the cable connection has been working since yesterday afternoon, so hopefully the issue is corrected... I think it was Comcast being screwed up and they either wouldn't admit it or didn't have the expertise to figure it out... I just hope it doesn't continue to be unstable... I want to get rid of the DSL soon, but I don't want to be stuck without an internet connection...

[PrntRhd]

Budfred,
I just PMed you a link to a ComcastHSI tech forum at BBR that may help with your issues, some real Comcast techs are there, not outsource contractors or know-nothings. You can post there with or without registration, it is free in either instance.
There is also an in-house Help forum inside the Comcast.net home page, you would use your email password to access it.
My Comcast connection had some issues early but has been solid and fast for over 12 months now. One of the issues in my situation was loose connections at the TVs, and that issue affected the HSI.

[Whyzman]

One of the issues in my situation was loose connections at the TVs, and that issue affected the HSI.Mine was actually out on the pole... What I had become accustomed to, was a "standard" TV picture that was not quite sterling. The ailing high-speed signal warranted a service call that caught the problem. I now have a what appears to me to be an HDTV picture...without even having an HDTV TV! :D

I'm wondering if tech-support will check your "to the house" signal to ensure that you're up to speed entering your abode...without charge?

[Budfred]

The installer checked the signal strength at the existing outlet, which is what my computer is hooked up to, and said he was surprised at how strong the signal was... Supposedly, I should be good for the signal coming into the house, but I think it is something at Comcast that they are just not admitting...

I have checked my connections several times and they are all tight, so that doesn't seem to be the problem either... I do have an older, lower quality cable to the modem, so I will probably replace that eventually... However, it works fine when it works... Right now I am getting very fast page loads and downloads... It seems to be either all on or all off...

[Whyzman]

Your connection has not experienced conditions outside of the spring thaw as yet...I'm wondering if our Minnesota thaw might be wreaking havoc somethere along the lines...

It would be nice if Comcast would let you know if there are reports...but then, until they can nail something down I suspect that they'd be putting themselves into a culpable position by admitting such... :rolleyes:

[Budfred]

I just posted to that support forum, so we will see if they come up with anything... I looked at the modem settings and it looks like the signal strength might be poor, but I am not sure I know how to read it...

[PrntRhd]

I just posted to that support forum, so we will see if they come up with anything... I looked at the modem settings and it looks like the signal strength might be poor, but I am not sure I know how to read it...
Which one? The Comcast.net one?

[Whyzman]

I had a problem at the pole, but also I have a signal booster immediately after the cable line enters my home. What's the URL for your modem's diagnostic page?

[PrntRhd]

Which one? The Comcast.net one?
Nevermind, I found it, CTool will help there, pretty good.

[Budfred]

Nevermind, I found it, CTool will help there, pretty good.

What is CTool??

I believe the URL is the standard Motorola one and several other modems seem to use it as well, but I am not sure if that is what you are asking Whyzman...

[PrntRhd]

What is CTool??
Not what, who.
CableTool is a Comcast tech who replied to your post there.

[Budfred]

I swapped coaxial cables with one I had on my main TV and I am getting a good signal at this point... Apparently I need to invest in a couple more high quality cables...

[PrntRhd]

Yeah,
I had a "free install" deal, and the installer used a brand new one for the modem. I had other issues after the install, but glad to hear your connection is stabilizing.
:)

[Whyzman]

It seem to find myself wiring and rewiring things on a regular basis...sometimes I need a long cable, sometimes fairly short.

At Menards they have a kit that contains 10 coax compression fittings and the tool to make it happen. It is very similar to the tool and compression fittings that the field techs use...it's not one of the old torturous/highly ineffective crimping tools.

Compression fittings can be purchased separately if needed.

They also have a tool for under $10 that strips the cable...and it works!

[Budfred]

That kit is probably what I actually need... I got a 3' and 25' cable with my install kit and they are both good quality... However, the modem is only a few feet from the outlet and my TV is about 12' away, so I used the long cable for the TV and an old lower quality cable for the modem... The 3' cable was from the outlet to the splitter... I can chop that 25' cable up into 3 lengths to use for my main TV, the TV by the computer and (after I get another splitter) the cable connection to get TV in my computer... That would probably be way cheaper and more efficient than buying Monster Cable or something along that line...

If the connection holds up for another day or two, I will have the delightful task of contacting Qwest to sever all connections with them... I have a few more places to notify of my email address change and will need to let a number of people know that my home phone number is no longer valid, but it will be worth it to be done with them...

Thanks for the help with this guys... :cool:

[Whyzman]

That kit is probably what I actually need...That would probably be way cheaper and more efficient than buying Monster Cable or something along that line...Yes, indeed! The cable itself is fairly inexpensive, but it sounds like you already have a chunk ready to dice to more convenient lengths.

I've was jealous of the fieldtechs the first time I saw them put on a compression fitting. When I saw the tool with fittings at Menards it was a nobrainer... :D Jim Carey eat your heart out! :D:D

[Budfred]

An update...

I went to Menards intending to get the kit to cut up the cable and use it... I saw that they had what they claimed was high quality cable for a really good price and that it would cost me more to buy the kit, so I got the cables instead... I ended up with double images on my TV, but it was still better than when I had antenna, so I left it alone...

This weekend I went by CompUSA to see what kinds of deals they might have as they were closing out the store... Well, they didn't have a huge amount left and many things cost more with the 25% off than I could get them elsewhere with the normal price... I ended up finding the install kits for Comcast at 60% off which made them $8/box... Each box has a 3' and 25' cable in it that are very nice quality, so I bought 2 boxes... I replaced the cables from Menards and my TV pictures improved... I have a couple of 25' cables where I could use much shorter alternatives and it probably still would be a good idea to get a kit to shorten them one of these days, but they work well and I still have another 25' cable if I need it... I also have 2 splitters that I don't need and a bunch of thinks to attach the cables to a wall... Not the most efficient plan, but a good price for very good cables... :D

Meanwhile, Circuit City and Comcast screwed up my account, but I think I got it all sorted out now... I got Comcast partly so I could dump Qwest, but I am beginning to suspect that they may be just as bad or worse... However, the internet connection is much faster....