A Strange Problem - No Solution As Of Yet.

[Gtamaddog]

Hey, first post, need a little help. I intend to stick around after aswell.

Right, I upgraded my PC a bit earlier on in the year, it was around about in January. I mainly use my PC for internet use and online games and the online games was one of the reasons why I upgraded.

I was very happy with my new setup for about a month and then one day when I was on Counter Strike Source, I heard a very high pitched noise coming from inside my computer. With this, I had the added issue of the fps in CS and all of my other games as I later found out was dropping when this noise came about. My fps drops to a dead 9fps when this noise occurs. Never any more, never any less, this noise and the 9fps will stick around for about 30 seconds then it will disappear for 2-3 minutes before coming back. This problem, I think, is getting worse. Its actually occuring well I'm on IE watching video's on YouTube and believe it or not, its occured while I've been writing this. But, there is no difference in speed when on the desktop.

I have been told elsewhere that it could be due to an overheating problem, but I've had Mothorboard Monitor on and it says the temperature of my PC is 46 Celcius, this may be high, I'm not sure. But to help air-flow and cooling I've added two 9cm fans to the case, they havent made a difference. I also have another fan on the side of my PC case.

Another thing I have been told is that my video card may be the problem. I've been told its a dodgy one because it doesnt have a fan on it, its just some heat-pipes and heat-sinks. I've also been told that the video card I have is known for being faulty, but I want a sure fire answer if possible before I rush out and buy a new one and later find there is nothing wrong with the one that I have.

I don't think I can say much more about this problem, well, apart from my system specifications:

Asus A8V-VM SE (Green) Motherboard.
AMD Athlon 64bit 3800+ 2.4GHz.
Asus EAX1600 Silent 512MB. Basically an ATI X1600.
Kingston 1024MB RAM PC3200 184-Pin.
Western Digital 250GB Sata.
CMI8738/C3DX PCI Audio Device.
Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp_sp2_gdr.070227-2254).

Well, I hope one of you can atleast shed some light into this problem. I am basically at my wits end and am about to launch my PC out of the window.

Thanks in advance.

[odannyboy000]

Try a different video card on your system or try using your video card on a known working system.

[Gtamaddog]

Try a different video card on your system or try using your video card on a known working system.

Thanks for the fast response. I'll have a go at trying out what you suggested, but I think I'm going to find it hard to do so. This PC, which is the one with the problem, is the only PC which supports PCI-E chipsets, all the other PC's I have are AGP. But I'll see what I can do.

[ski]

If 46 C is the CPU's temperature, then you're ok. But if it's the 'System' temperature, then that's hot.
If it's the latter, then remove the computer's cover, and run an external fan on the system. If that cools things down and fixes the problem, then your case fans may be fighting each other. Describe your current case fan configuration, and the air flow direction for each case fan.

[Dngrsone]

I agree with the Video Card diagnosis. The card may be overheating. To check this, then you might want to open the case up and direct a fan on the heatsinks on the card... see if this eases the symptoms.

Also, investigate the drivers you have installed for the card... there may be a newer or older version (no, really... sometimes older is better) that will perform better for you.

Also, if the card is still new, perhaps you can get a warranty RMA.

[Gtamaddog]

If 46 C is the CPU's temperature, then you're ok. But if it's the 'System' temperature, then that's hot.
If it's the latter, then remove the computer's cover, and run an external fan on the system. If that cools things down and fixes the problem, then your case fans may be fighting each other. Describe your current case fan configuration, and the air flow direction for each case fan.

Ah, forgot to say that 46 C is the CPU temperature. Its good to know that my CPU is atleast safe.

I agree with the Video Card diagnosis. The card may be overheating. To check this, then you might want to open the case up and direct a fan on the heatsinks on the card... see if this eases the symptoms.

Also, investigate the drivers you have installed for the card... there may be a newer or older version (no, really... sometimes older is better) that will perform better for you.

Also, if the card is still new, perhaps you can get a warranty RMA.

Well I highly suspect it to be an overheating problem on with the video card. So, I will try out the test you suggested. I have already investigated the drivers, used a driver cleaner and installed different drivers each time, they had no effect as far as I could tell.

[ski]

See if the noise occurs with the computer's cover removed and no external fan running. If it does, then you may be able to pinpoint the location of the noise, which in turn will help us to determine the cause.

[alex666]

Another thing I have been told is that my video card may be the problem. I've been told its a dodgy one because it doesnt have a fan on it, its just some heat-pipes and heat-sinks. I've also been told that the video card I have is known for being faulty, but I want a sure fire answer if possible before I rush out and buy a new one and later find there is nothing wrong with the one that I have.

Who is telling you this? How credible are they? Also, have you googled your specific video card make and model + "makes whining sound", something like that? The fact that it's now happening on non-graphic intensive tasks makes me wonder if it's something other than your video card. I'd be reluctant to latch onto a specific culprit too early. Who knows, it could be your cpu, cpu fan, your psu, or even your hard drive. Do you have SMART enabled in your bios for your hdd? If so, and even if you don't, then you might want to download HD Tune. It will give you snapshot of your hdd's health. In any case, if you have any valuable data on your hdd, you might want to back it up just to be safe.

You might want to do what ski suggested, take off the cover and listen to where the sound might be. That can be easier said than done, but it's worth a shot.

And finally, Gtamaddog, welcome to the PC Guide forums. Some really good folks here with good knowledge and willing to help.

Good luck.

marty

[Gtamaddog]

Who is telling you this? How credible are they? Also, have you googled your specific video card make and model + "makes whining sound", something like that? The fact that it's now happening on non-graphic intensive tasks makes me wonder if it's something other than your video card. I'd be reluctant to latch onto a specific culprit too early. Who knows, it could be your cpu, cpu fan, your psu, or even your hard drive. Do you have SMART enabled in your bios for your hdd? If so, and even if you don't, then you might want to download HD Tune. It will give you snapshot of your hdd's health. In any case, if you have any valuable data on your hdd, you might want to back it up just to be safe.

You might want to do what ski suggested, take off the cover and listen to where the sound might be. That can be easier said than done, but it's worth a shot.

And finally, Gtamaddog, welcome to the PC Guide forums. Some really good folks here with good knowledge and willing to help.

Good luck.

marty

Well taking your advice into account, so far I have disabled SMART and downloaded and run HD Tune. No errors were found, which I suspected as my HD is only a few months old and there isn't that much on it.

I also tried taking the cover off and attempting to pinpoint the sound before. I will have to try that again as I can't remember where I located it to.

Oh and these source's that I am saying I have gotten suggestions off are loads of people, I've been to quite a few internet forums/place's before here, but they all seemed to give me the same answer. I could swear they were trying to sell me computer components more than helping me solve my problem.

Oh, and, thanks for the welcome. Much appreciated.

[alex666]

Whoa, I never said disable SMART. There's no reason to do so.

Hmm, if people are trying to sell you stuff . . . . . :eek: I'd be careful. It may well be your video card, who knows. I'm just trying to identify what would (1) slow down frame rates and (2) produce a high-pitched squealing sound and for me, hdd jumps to the front of the list, but I'm just guessing. Gotta go.

marty

[Gtamaddog]

Well I just tried locating the whining sound, and I suspect that its around the PSU area, but I'm not 100% certain. I have had problems with this PSU before but its the only one I had that had the correct connectors for the PSU to work with my mother-board. It used to be really dodgy and it would take some doing to get the PSU up and running but since I've put it in this PC its been fine, starting first time atleast.

But would a PSU really cause such a problem as a drop in FPS? Could this mean that the PSU is almost dead and not supplying the power it says it should on the side of the case?

As I said before I'm not 100% certain its coming from the PSU but it sounds like its coming from around there.

I only disabled SMART for one run, its enabled again now.

[david eaton]

It could be the PSU. Have you checked the voltages. Probably under PC health in the BIOS. Sometimes, if the psu is being overrun, the inductors can vibrate, and the printed circuit board can act as a resonator. What it the wattage of the supply, and the rating of the various rails.

[Fruss Tray Ted]

As I said before I'm not 100% certain its coming from the PSU but it sounds like its coming from around there.
A carry over trick from automotive mechanics is to use a non conductive rod such as a wooden or plastic dowel and place one end near where you suspect the noise to be coming from. Noisy valves etc, are very easy to isolate this way.

In this case, on the PSU, edge of a fan or printed circuit card or it's frame with the other end pressed against your cheek just in front of your ear. You will quickly be able to tell the source of the noise very easily when you compare it to another area.

Just be careful not to put it directly onto any circuits or electrical components. Nearby the source is enough. I have had to track down noises in this way on pc's and it works great!

[alex666]

A carry over trick from automotive mechanics is to use a non conductive rod such as a wooden or plastic dowel and place one end near where you suspect the noise to be coming from. Noisy valves etc, are very easy to isolate this way.

In this case, on the PSU, edge of a fan or printed circuit card or it's frame with the other end pressed against your cheek just in front of your ear. You will quickly be able to tell the source of the noise very easily when you compare it to another area.

Just be careful not to put it directly onto any circuits or electrical components. Nearby the source is enough. I have had to track down noises in this way on pc's and it works great!

Cool Fruss.

[Thayer]

Hey, first post, need a little help. I intend to stick around after aswell.

Right, I upgraded my PC a bit earlier on in the year, it was around about in January. I mainly use my PC for internet use and online games and the online games was one of the reasons why I upgraded.


Hey there, I have a similar problem on a thread I posted about a week ago. It is here:

http://www.pcguide.com/vb/showthread.php?t=57318

I have determined the sound is definitelty coming from the GPU. However, I don't think it has anything to do with overheating as I can make the sound stop and start whenever I want. If there is a certain type of 3D graphical load on the card it makes the sound, right now, as I write this there is no sound. I am about to load up WoW and I know the sound will start on the logon screen when I have to enter my password, then after I choose a character and it is on the 2D loading screen the sound will stop. After my character is in the world it starts again. I can ALT-TAB to Windows anytime I want to stop the sound. It is a similar situation on other games.

I have done quite a bit of research on this and it seems many people have this aame problem. I have an ASUS 8600GTS card. Unfortunately I don't have any way to test another PCI-E GPU right now, so I don't know if it is all cards or only certain ones or if there is another variable in my system making this happen (Keeping in mind my PSU is new, good quality brand and ample power, and I have stopped all fans individually so I know the sound is not from there - it is without a doubt from the GPU).

[Gtamaddog]

Hey there, I have a similar problem on a thread I posted about a week ago. It is here:

http://www.pcguide.com/vb/showthread.php?t=57318

I have determined the sound is definitelty coming from the GPU. However, I don't think it has anything to do with overheating as I can make the sound stop and start whenever I want. If there is a certain type of 3D graphical load on the card it makes the sound, right now, as I write this there is no sound. I am about to load up WoW and I know the sound will start on the logon screen when I have to enter my password, then after I choose a character and it is on the 2D loading screen the sound will stop. After my character is in the world it starts again. I can ALT-TAB to Windows anytime I want to stop the sound. It is a similar situation on other games.

I have done quite a bit of research on this and it seems many people have this aame problem. I have an ASUS 8600GTS card. Unfortunately I don't have any way to test another PCI-E GPU right now, so I don't know if it is all cards or only certain ones or if there is another variable in my system making this happen (Keeping in mind my PSU is new, good quality brand and ample power, and I have stopped all fans individually so I know the sound is not from there - it is without a doubt from the GPU).

Hmmm, thanks for that. It made some interresting reading at least.

Well I've been doing some research on my own card, well the official ATI version of it. Many of the reviews I've read on it have been saying that it is a bit iffy in place's and its best to stay away. I'm not exactly impressed by the performance of mine anyway. I was silly enough to think it was an amazing card in the first place because I saw it had 512MB.

I think I might bite the bullet and buy a new video card and PSU. I havent got any spare PSU's or video cards lying around that will connect to my current motherboard. The weird thing is, is that I was looking at your card the other day, the exact same one and I was thinking of buying it.

Well, I can't listen out for the noise any more because its stopped. Its done this before. It probably wont come back for another two weeks. So I can't really look into it now, which is a shame because I wanted to find the culprit component this time around.

[ski]

I'm not exactly impressed by the performance of mine anyway. I was silly enough to think it was an amazing card in the first place because I saw it had 512MB.
FWIW, gobs of RAM on a video card does not make it a fast performer, as you have found out. The only thing that a lot of RAM does is to enable the card to display higher resolutions. It's the speed of the GPU and the RAM that makes a video card fast. However, manufacturers have been loading up their 'value' cards with a lot of inexpensive slow RAM hoping that this will induce unknowing customers to buy them.

[Matt]

About the noise:

I've not heard a whining noise myself coming from a video card. I used to have an old Abit Geforce ti4200 that had a GPU that would make a constant chirping noise when you had Direct3D gaming running (would speed up and slow down with the FPS too!). That particular card did burn out, but never really had the symptoms you've described.

If the whining noise is coming from your PSU, it *could* be a fan getting ready to go. If you don't hear it anymore, you might want to check and make sure that any and all fans are actually working. You can even sometimes get faulty PSU fans to act up on the spot if you power down and then back up your PC.

If your PSU is overheating, that *could* cause some slowdown as a PSU should actually become less efficient as it overheats. I don't know how much stress you're putting it under either, but something that could help out would be for you to post the specs of your Power Supply Unit: Max watts, DC output ratings (min/max for +12v, +3.3, +5v, ect.).

[Gtamaddog]

My PSU is a Magna ATX 500W.

AC-I/P: 115/230v 6a/3a 60/50hz

DC, O/P: +3.3v 28A, +5v 40A, +12v 17A

[david eaton]

Those power outputs look like an older PSU. Newer models have a much greater wattage on the 12V.( or two or more 12V rails.) Have you checked in the BIOS for actual voltages? I strongly suspect that the !2V rail is overloaded.

[Matt]

17 amps seems to be very little for the 12v rail on a 500w power supply. You should have something closer to 24 amps or so. I think...

[Gtamaddog]

17 amps seems to be very little for the 12v rail on a 500w power supply. You should have something closer to 24 amps or so. I think...

So would it be possible that this is slowing my system up? Or would this not effect performance at all?

I have 0% experience when it comes to things like this, so I won't go into any sort of detail because I don't know anything about it.

[david eaton]

I would bet that if you check in the BIOS, probably under pc health(?) you would find that the 12volt rail is seriously low! Due to overloading.
I think that you need a new power supply I just checked an old psu and for a 400 watt It had a 12 volt rail at 18amps.

[Gtamaddog]

I would bet that if you check in the BIOS, probably under pc health(?) you would find that the 12volt rail is seriously low! Due to overloading.
I think that you need a new power supply I just checked an old psu and for a 400 watt It had a 12 volt rail at 18amps.


Look in the BIOS a few days ago, there are sections about power management but as far as I can remember, nothing about PC Health.

I'll have another look but I doubt anything will show up.

I will most likely be buying a new PSU either way, just to knock the PSU out of the equation, even if it isnt the PSU that is causing it. But you seem pretty certain that something is up with the PSU.