Crash

[George Hallam]

Last month my PC froze for a few seconds then crashed now today it did the same thing. i had just finished playing BF 2142 (i closed it) once i did that i opened MSN, Azureus, Firefox, I-tunes at the same time (clicked on the icons quick) thats all i can say??? no bios error i always have NV monitor running and the CPU was normal and so was GPU temp. when it turn back on a window saying windows has encountered a serious error can i have some help? is it because i opened lots of programs at the same time it doesn't usually crash it

thanks George

[Jiggy]

Hi George,

How many programs/apps are you running in in the back ground (sys tray) ?

Could it be from overclocking, you could try lowering the setting changed.

[Sylvander]

I think a crash is usually caused by...

1. There being a shortage of memory space and programs are beginning to "step on each others' toes" [ actually, due to a shortage, one prog writes to another prog's memory space, and when the 2nd prog fetches the data from that space it doesn't understand the data fetched and crashes].

OR...
2. There isn't a shortage of memory space, but some program is misbehaving by using space allocated to another program anyway.

QUESTIONS
3. Do you have enough RAM?

4. Is your swap-file big enough? Is it of fixed size or does Windows manage it? Is there plenty of free space [for the swap-file] on the partition where the swap-file resides?

[Igore B]

may i ask:
why the need to use the swap file in Windows ? this isn't anything fully mentally lost after all, just the performance-wise....,
but since the swap file as i know in Windows is chosen as default from the beginning, not the same as Linux when users create partitions for the system, so i wonder:
were swap file ideas taken from Linux or Windows originally? if it was from windows, which version ? there are many, i don't know.

?

[George Hallam]

not sure what Igor B is talking about ???

first jiggy
at the moment i am running 36 but usually im running 29 (if you mean process on task manager) about the overclocking i did think about that but it all runs at low temps. what could it be?

second Sylvander
i have 2Gb of DDR 800 (well at 854) 2GB is plenty for XP im not getting 4GB until i get Vista. I'm not 100% what swap file is i think its in case you dont have enough RAM it does the same job but slower. My XP partition is 10Gb and it has 2.4Gb free. on Nv monitor my HDD usage is always 0% (apart from when loading up programs or moving things)

does that help

[Sylvander]

"why the need to use the swap file in Windows?"
Why not? It seems like a smart idea to use a memory hierarchy going all the way from [fast, but very expensive] internal cache through [less fast, and less expensive] RAM to [even slower, and even less expensive] swap-file on the HDD.
If high cost was no problem [cost should always be prudently minimised], all the PC's in the world would be very expensive and using ONLY the most expensive form of memory.
When using a memory hierarchy, the things in memory most repeatedly fetched by the CPU go up to the highest [fastest] memory.
As things are used less they go down the hierarchy until they end up in the swap file.
Hence, things used most infrequently take the longest to fetch, but why not since they are so infrequently used.

"I'm not 100% what swap file is"
It's a file on a partition [normally C:] on the HDD.
I have mine set to a fixed size on C: about twice the size of my RAM [because I don't have much RAM].
If the swap-file fails to meet the demand Windows complains and I increase the size.
If you have lots of RAM [as you do George] it becomes less necessary to have any swap-file at all.
Looks like lack of memory is not a problem here.

[George Hallam]

my OS is not on C it on D. my C is an empty formated 10GB partiton (dont ask why) it has 2gb of used space that is improbable the swap.

[Sylvander]

1. Which Windows version are you running?

2. What's occupying the 2 GB of used space on C:?

3. Where is your swap-file and how big is it?
My Win200Pro swap-file is in C:\pagefile.sys
WinDirStat (http://windirstat.info/) will show you your space usage including relative file sizes and where your swap-file is and how big.

Here's mine...
Notice it's much bigger than all the other typical file sizes around it.

[George Hallam]

1. windows XP home SP2
2. i think its Ubuntu remains not sure
3. on mine on that WinDirStat i have 2Gb and on task manager it says i have 4Gb??
look

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/8972/untitlediw7.jpg

and

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/6706/untitledaf4.jpg

the big blue 1 is my page file its in the same place as yours but D:\

edit: that 2Gb on c was page file aswell

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/3734/untitledfe0.jpg

[Sylvander]

Check out "Your PC->Properties->Advanced->Performance Options->Virtual Memory->Change->Paging File Size" [or similar].
[See mine in screenshot below]

How come there is a "Paging File" on your "Boot Partition" D: and also another 2GB "Paging File" on your "System Partition" C:?
I notice your 2.0 GB C:\pagefile.sys is 100% used and "last change" to it was today, which suggests it's presently in use.
So, WHY IS IT SO HUGE?
.

[George Hallam]

i haven't got a clue lol :p thought you could help

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/1913/untitledvf5.jpg

doest look like theres PF on C:\ ????

[Sylvander]

I notice...
The "Volume Label" for drive C: says "OS Vista"!

So the previous OS on C: was Vista?
And it has been eliminated somehow?
And the Vista "paging File" was not eliminated, but left behind?

[George Hallam]

it was but then formatted lol i really dont know how it happened :p

[George Hallam]

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/9274/untitledsp8.jpg

it just did it again this is the error that is says is wrong???

[Sylvander]

"IT was but then formatted"
What's the "IT" that was? The previous OS was Vista?
Do you want Vista? On C:?
Would you want to attempt to UN-FORMAT C:?
Or reinstall Vista?
Or do you have any image backups of C: [and even D:] made when all was well?

"IT just did IT again"
Is this a different IT to the last IT? So what the !"£$%^& is IT?
Do you mean the PC has crashed yet again?
Those files listed give details that might be understood by an "expert".

[George Hallam]

sorry about the vague post i was abit ticked off (to put it politely) on C: it had vista i downloaded it to see what it was like once the 30days were up i formated the HDD since then and installed Ubuntu i will format C: if you want as it is just free space at the moment. i dont have any images of D: all game and applications are installed on a different partition so would is it just a case of re-installing XP + drivers or would i have to re-install all my games and software.

and the second it :p (soz again) yes it did crash i was just on I-tunes here and MSN all of the temps were fine and suddenly it froze for about a second then my speakers made a buzzing sound for about 2secs then it just re-booted no bios report or errors in the start up screens. is that more help

btw i couldn't find those error reports i looked in the folders and viewed hidden files and no look :(

[Sylvander]

1. "i formatted the HDD since then and installed Ubuntu"
HDD's are not formatted, they are partitioned, and it is the partitions that are then formatted.
So did you reformat C: alone, or both C: and D:?
If you reformatted C: alone, that might be the cause of your PC's problems.
I'm no expert on it, but I believe it's necessary to install XP 1st and then Vista 2nd, and then getting rid of Vista would be tricky.
Ideally you'd have images of C: and D: with the pre-Vista arrangement, and restore those.
I guess with Vista installed there would be a Vista boot loader being used to load XP.
I wonder if installing Ubuntu fixed that?
It's all beyond my level of understanding.
Paul Komski's the guy for this.

2. "i will format C: if you want as it is just free space at the moment"
The trouble is...
It isn't all free space.
There's a 2 GB swap file on there.
And it seems to be in use! :(
Which I don't understand.
What is it in use by?

3. "is it just a case of re-installing XP + drivers or would i have to re-install all my games and software?"
Yes, if doing a fresh install, you'd need to reinstall your games and other software.
If you are prepared to put in the work, it seems like it would be a good idea to [zero-fill the drive?] repartition, format those partitions, and install XP anew.
Then make backup images right after installing Windows, then as you install programs, and at key points as you move forward software-wise.

4. "is that more help?"
Not really, because although my guess is that it's a software problem, I don't know the exact cause.
How I deal with software problems...
(a) Start with a new, perfect software system [totally free of any kind of software chaos].
(b) Move all data files off the Windows partition [C:?]
(c) Make an image of the Windows partition [not a bad idea to make images of the data partitions too]
(d) As you move forward from day to day with changes taking place to the partition contents...
Make images at key points when all's well [no chaos has crept in].
(e) Make a written log of backups, restores, installs, uninstalls, software updates, significant configuration alterations.
(f) If you so much as suspect that all's not well with the software [some tiny chaotic element has been introduced]...
Restore a suitable image backup [the most recent?] of the Windows partition [and any other partition contents you suspect may have been affected].
If something nasty had been introduced, it's gone...
If there was nothing amiss, no harm has been done.
You will have lost the most recent software changes, but if needed they can be re-done.
e.g. As soon as you saw this present misbehaviour...
You'd restore a [CLEAN] image...
The problem would be gone.
If it wasn't, then it wouldn't be a plain software problem, so you focus elsewhere like hardware and/or BIOS configuration settings.
(g) Lets say it was an infection and restoring a clean image didn't eliminate it.
You'd need to clean out the other areas that could be affected.
You might zero-fill the HDD, then repartition, then format those partitions, then restore the clean image[s].
Restoring an image ALWAYS works when I do it. But then I've never had an infection [they know better than to try methinks].

[George Hallam]

thanks for the post and the time and detail im away at the moment for 5 days in the UK for my grandads funeral, i have left my PC on and when i get back i will see if has crashed if not i will wait until i get real copy VISTA and re-install XP. it may not be a S/W problem might be H/W related due to OC'ing. i will post more when i get back. and again thanks for the detailed post