RAID...Is it worth it?

[bassvax]

I'm building a new system and have purchased the following:

ASUS A7V133 (VIA Apollo KT133A Chipset) with RAID Option
AMD Athlon 1 gig (not yet but next week unless I hear of a better CPU for this mobo)
Creative Sound Blaster Live Platinum 5.1
ASUSTek Geforce 2 GTS Ultra 64MB DDR
512MB RAM from Crucial
Samsung Syncmaster 955DF 19" Monitor 0.20 dot pitch
Intellimouse Optical
SMC Ethernet card
Generic Floppy
Creative 56k modem (soft...I know, but I'm going cable in a couple of months so got a cheapy)
Don't have a keyboard or case yet BUT I am definetely interested in hearing about suggestions for off-the-wall cases colorful and toolless.

So my main quest here is to get feedback from you, the users, on whether I should incorporate the RAID configuration (buying two 20GB HD's) or just use a nice biggy and chop it up and use the standard config. I am not a gamer of intensity, but play a few 3D intensive games. I do not game on line either. I am not planning on running a business or being a server. Will I really benefit from RAID? I've read Charles' rather indepth writing on the topic in the PC Guide, but I am looking for your input.

Thanks to all that offer up experiences and suggestions http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

ps-Note to Pete...I was a die-hard Pentium fan until I looked at prices and researched the newer AMD's and this mobo...Life changes http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Jerry

[This message has been edited by bassvax (edited 02-05-2001).]

[sea69]

Hi

I am researching (Raid) however I have the ATh T-Bird 751 (pci to bridge) chipset. (@800Mhz-upgrad to over 1,2 gig) and it is pre-raid, but is very very nice (useing Win98se)

so far only thing I can say tho, is what u already know. Since u r spending all this $$ to begin w/ don't use that software modem.. its an insult to ur machine, and even with cable/dsl connection u still need a good hardware modem for those 'down times', (depending on who u get service from this can be more down than up.. and in the mean time having a good modem will save u MANY headaches.

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"Remember u r 'unique'... just like everyone else!"

[Ghost_Hacker]

I think it depends on the operating system. NT almost always runs faster in a RAID configuration. 9x doesn't seem to improve all that much.
But I'm not a big fan of over 30GB hard drives either unless they're spinning at 10,000rpm. I say either go for one very fast hard drive or two
drives in a raid configuration.

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"It's just a whisper in my Ghost"

[kenja]

My US$0.02:
If a person is truly interested in hard drive performance, they'll have to spend the big bucks and go with SCSI.

I've been playing around with an Iwill SIDERAID66 board. Currently have two 30GB, 7200RPM, ATA66 Quantum Fireball LM drives hooked up to it. The Iwill uses a Highpoint chip (as seen on Abit boards), not the Promise chip that is used on your Asus MB.

Is an IDE RAID configuration worth it? Yeah, I think so. I'm running Windows 2000 on an NTFS partition, and here's some rough average figures from SiSoft's Sandra 2001 (bypassing the Windows cache): With striped disks (aka mode 0): Drive Index=27000. With a single disk on the adapter, the Drive Index=16000. (Units of what? Grains of Sandra, I guess http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif .)

Interestingly, the reported access time in striped mode was always 8ms. In independent mode, the results were about evenly split between 7ms and 8ms. IDE RAID is a BIOS implementation and requires the attention of the motherboard CPU (unlike SCSI RAID adapters that contain their own processor). My CPU is an 800MHz Duron, and I'm a little surprised that the extra overhead of the RAID configuration was evident (just a guess).

I'm not currently set up for dual booting with Win9x, perhaps the processor overhead issue is involved more.

My personal conclusion: The real-world performance increase of IDE RAID is noticeable, but I wish I had bought a single, quality drive (like a Maxtor DiamondMax+ ). I like my other Quantums well enough, but these particular models have a painfully high-pitched whine and sound like miniature rock crushers.

[Ghel]

Yeah, but if your going with SCSI, why not just grab the gusto and go fiber channel http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/tongue.gif

Ok, maybe that's just overkill. Is there suck a thing?!?

[ComputerMan]

I too am researching RAID so I am not capable of answering your question totally, it sounds all good though. I did, however, want to make a suggestion. you said your going with the AMD 1 gig, good choice, no doubt but make sure you put it in a case with plenty of cooling. Even AMD will tell you they havent worked out all the cooling problems on these cpu's and they run warm. Get a good case!!

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Who? Me?

computerMan

[kenja]

I second ComputerMan's motion. Further: try to get a power supply that is on AMD's "approved" list. I looked at the AMD list of approved HSFs (HeatSink-Fan) assemblies, but I don't recall seeing any of them being sold at the retail level. I purchased a HSF from PcPowerandCooling.com, and my Duron 800 is quite happy with it (but the 1GHz Thunderbird is in another realm for power and heat dissipation requirements).

My Antec SX1030 "SOHO File Sever" has plenty of ventilation capabilities. I like the way it looks with the front door removed (no accounting for taste, I guess http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/wink.gif ). As for "colorful": well, you can get it in black (mine's beige). Install three thumbscrews on the main access panel, and it becomes essentially "tooless". (I'd prefer to have rigidly mounted 5.25" drives, though.)

I think it's only sold with a 300W supply installed (approved up to 1GHz). If I were to fill up all 10 drive bays and had a 1 GHz Thunderbird, I'd be shopping for a 400W power supply. (I'm currently debating whether to get the Leadman (Powmax) 6100D from CompGeeks.com, just "because" http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif ). Overclockers Australia reviewed the power supply here (http://www.overclockers.com.au/techstuff/r_lm400psu/index.shtml).

About the 1GHz Thunderbird: I was just at AMD.com; it is the slowest (as if http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif ) processor that can make use of the 266MHz FSB.

[kenja]

[P.S.:] Antec also makes a similar eight-bay case called the "SX830".

[blazer2boy]

Enlight also makes a good case. It comes with a 300 watt PS that has a 3 yr warrnt on the PS. I dont have the model its at home right now. Also came with 2 fans and ability to add 3rd.

Cheers http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Blazer

[bassvax]

Thanks for all the great words of wisdom. I did buy an Antec case with 300watt PS. I really think I'm gonna wait to try RAID later on. On another topic do you guys/gals think that Samsung Syncmaster 955DF 0.20 dot pitch will do the Geforce GTS 2 Ultra 64MB DDR any justice?

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Jerry

[dennis]

Don't RAID for what you are using the machine for. Get yourself a few smaller, faster hd's rather than one big one. Just my opinion.

[hacker]

Back to the RAID, Better performance with RAID 0 ,striping, but if one drive dies, ALL data, on bothh drives is lost.

Was thinking of getting a raid controler, but, this made me decide not to.

Good Luck!

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I was called "hacker" before there was a HeathKit.

[kenja]

Good point, hacker. (I believe Charles has alluded to this in the Guide http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif: RAID in mode 0 presents the opportunity for more things to go wrong.)

Although I'm impressed by the reliability of modern (voice coil) drives, I plan to have a third drive (on a separate controller) for storing compressed images (using Drive Image or Ghost) of the RAID set. (I also make CD-Rs or CD-RWs of the images periodically.)

[This message has been edited by kenja (edited 02-09-2001).]

[kenja]

[Update:]

Norton Ghost (2001, "Personal Edition") works great with IDE-RAID (mode 0). Power Quest Drive Image does not (at least not the "ME" version that came bundled with the eleventh edition of Upgrading and Repairing PCs).

P.S.: About the Samsung CRT: the dot pitch is (somewhat deceptively) specified in horizontal terms, not in the industry-standard diagonal terms.

The specs can be translated using Pythagorean theorem: hypotenuse of a right triangle equals the square root of the sum of the squares of the other two sides. So...the square root of 0.04 + 0.04 equals (just over) 0.28, which is not nearly as impressive.

Does seem to be a good monitor (especially with the current $30 rebate), judging by this (http://sysopt.earthweb.com/userreviews/monitors/reviewhtml/Samsung_SyncMaster_955DF.html), this (http://www.zdnet.com/smartbusinessmag/stories/all/0%2C6605%2C2598259%2C00.html), and this (http://www.epinions.com/cmhd-Monitors-All-Samsung_SyncMaster_955DF).



[This message has been edited by kenja (edited 02-12-2001).]

[kenja]

[Correction to the Update:]

Here is the review (of the monitor's 17" brother) that I couldn't find when I wrote the last post: (Australian) (http://www.dansdata.com/753df.htm). The vertical dot pitch is 0.125mm, which makes the diagonal pitch 0.2358mm .

P.S.: Since the title of this thread is about IDE-RAID, here is Dan's (the (presumed) Australian) amusing article about being an "early adopter" of an Abit RAID board (and of Windows 2000):dansdata (http://www.dansdata.com/raidagain.htm). A good overview of IDE-RAID: more dansdata (http://www.dansdata.com/raid.htm).

[This message has been edited by kenja (edited 02-12-2001).]

[bassvax]

Thanks Kenja for all the info and advice. I stuck with the basci setup for now. Due to my impatience I settled for a 32MB ASUS AGP 7100($129) instead of the new 64MB DDR. I will get one later. I also had to settle for the 17" version of the monitor, but that is what I bought my kids and I like it. Dan's Data is a great site. I found it when I was researching to upgrade the kid's computer back in July 2000. Thanks again http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Jerry

[kenja]

[Update:]

The Antec cases I mentioned are available with 400W power supplies. They're named SX840 and SX1040.

About AMD approved heatsinks: For 1.2GHz, using PriceWatch.com I found Coolermaster, Global Win, and Taisol HSFs.

[Neovox]

Not a slam on the original poster but if you are not a gamer, not running as server, not doing heavy graphics and this is your home desktop, why do you need such a race car?

I know a guy who is running a DEC Alpha station with duel Xieon(sp?) processors as his home computer, and I can't help but ask myself what for?

Again, this is not a slam on the original poster because of course everyone wants to drive the race car, but I just have touble digesting it on my end.

I'll shut up now. . . http://www.PCGuide.com/ubb/mad.gif