Challenge to Saph

[pop pop]

I have $3000 plus to spend to upgrade now...my system is 4 years old. I have ideas...quad+ only, but what do you think?:cool:

[Ajmukon]

Saph would say the same thing i am about to say:
Intel 45nm Quad-core (coming out in JAN 08)

But-
what will it be used for? (Gaming, video, websurfing...)
i assume gaming?

[George Hallam]

oooo $3000 to spend :p i will leave it to him them :(

[pop pop]

Here's my stab at it. All prices and components are from Newegg...

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 - $280
Gigabyte GA-X38T-DQ6 (also will support 45nm CPU) - 300
EVGA 8800GTS 640Mb HDCP - 385
Corsair DDR3 1600 CAS 7 (2Gb) ~ 490
150Gb WD Raptor - 175
2 Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 @ 500Gb each - 250
Antec Performance One P180 Mid Tower Case - 130
Antec True Power Trio 650W PSU (three 12V rails) - 115
Asus DVD Burner w/LightScribe (SATA) 40

and....

ViewSonic VX2435wm 24" 1080p HDCP Widescreen LCD - 650

Total cost w/o the OS: $2815 :cool: :D

With Vista Ultimate 64-bit OEM $2995

Waddya think?

[dafink]

I assume gaming as well, our needs are similar it seems.

That's a sweet monitor, response time is a little slow for typical use but I don't know if that's for gaming or if GTG is gaming.

I did find a review on it for your reading pleasure.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/displays/review/2007/06/06/ViewSonic-VX2435wm-24in-LCD-Monitor/p1

[pop pop]

The BenQ in the review is all around better and a tiny bit cheaper. The weaknesses in the ViewSonic design were pretty much spot on...I just have a weak spot for ViewSonic and have owned several with good experiences.

BenQ FP241W ir is @ $640

BTW...GTG is grey-to-grey. It a way of measuring response time. Likely it slant the response time to make it seem quicker than a transition from black to white and vice versa.

[George Hallam]

well your choices seem ok apart from a couple of things
-a 8800GTS is now beaten by the cheaper 8800GT look at these benchmarks

theres some of the new 3800 series aswell

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/7942/image0071fedd4fid6.png

http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/963/image013200039fzd4.png

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/7503/image014200b480os0.png

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/6176/image010201467frt8.png

http://images.tomshardware.com/2007/11/15/amd_radeon_hd_3800/image009.png

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/6962/image005202c995vc1.png

as you can see the 8800GT beats the GTS and nearly the GTX, the 3870 is a good 3rd or 4th but these babies (well the 3850's) can go in quad crossfire :D so when some benchmarks come out for them they will be interesting.

-in my personal opinion DDR3 is still a waist of $$$ stick with fast DDR2 1066 you can probably get 4Gb of it for that price

-CPU wise WAIT!! the Q6600 is a monster... but the release of the 9700/600/500 at the same price range and in 45nm will sure beat it hands down.. so get a cheap and cheerful E4000 series if you buy your PC now.. If your a fan of AMD im sure you have heard about their new Phenom True quad cores but there not all that great but quite cheap

[pentachris]

I'd recommend a different optical drive (http://www.maximumpc.com/article/samsung_sh_s203b) at a slightly And cheaper price. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151153&Tpk=samsung%2bSH-S203B)

Any reason you wouldn't want this highly touted motherboard? (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131074)

Also... sounds card?

[pop pop]

Thanks for the recommendations.

The video card results are interesting. I'll have to look at that more. I also know the 8800GTS 320 Factory over-clocked beats a lot of other cards in price/performance too. Something to think about.

The optical is a toss up. One is pretty much as good as another. Write speed and reliability are key.

I looked at the Striker Extreme closely. Three things held me back. One is the Gigabyte will support the 45 nanometer core coming out next year. Striker won't. Second was all the bad reviews about BIOS issues. I hate that. And I KNOW for a fact that Asus tech support is zilch...nada...though I've built several systems with Asus and no problems except when it came to Linux. But nonetheless, I hate BIOS issues cause you can't do anything, the board maker has too. Third was price. The upgradeablity and the quality of materials (lots o' copper sinks) in the Gigabyte just seem to make it a better buy.

OFF TOPIC>>>

BTW...COD4 demo is awesome. Ordered the full game tonight. :p :D :cool:

[pop pop]

How dare you SPAM my thread dirt bag.

[George Hallam]

BTW...COD4 demo is awesome. Ordered the full game tonight. :p :D :cool:


i know its great and so is the game...

o ye what are your current system specs ?


How dare you SPAM my thread dirt bag.

huh?

[Ajmukon]

George:
they(mjc) got him quick- the dirt bag spammer- he is now in bitbucket hell...
he spamed about 6 or so topics

and the GT is the best mid-range card, but for 3,000 get an ULTRA 768?MB for true pleasure in gaming

[George Hallam]

o right i thought i had missed something :p

and the GT is the best mid-range card, but for 3,000 get an ULTRA 768?MB for true pleasure in gaming

ye you could but two GT's for the same price and SLI for 40-50% more performance... but i suppose thats if he gets a SLI MOBO

i think Quad 3850 or 3870 will be nice :D

[jlreich]

Just FYI, now that Crysis is out I wouldn't expect to see Saph around for awhile. ;) :p

[George Hallam]

haha i know i haven't seen him around in a while... i need to buy it.. when i get it i might suddenly get a cold and have just happen to have a week of school :D

[pop pop]

OK...I decided to make a change in monitor and video card and that also means a change in the PSU. So these are the new components:

BenQ FP24 ($10 cheaper)
8800GTX (add $200)
PC Power and Cooling Silencer 750 (add $55, for now)

New total w/o the OS = $3060

Expensive? Yeah. Sweet? You bet. :p :D :cool:

[Ajmukon]

it is still in the price range....:p ;) :rolleyes: :D

which 8800GTX?
and i assume you will want VISTA.. 64BIT Home PREMIUM at least.
then MAX out the RAM on your MOBO

[jlreich]

I would lose the 2GB DDR3 and go for the much cheaper 4GB DDR2. I haven't looked at your mobo but I am assuming it supports both. DDR3 just isn't needed yet even with the new 45nm CPU's coming out next year. You can get DDR3 later if you want when prices drop and latencies get better.

Nice choice on the PSU.

Definitely get 64bit if going with vista. Saph is always saying vista isn't worth it unless you go 64bit.

It's of course up to you, but if you are holding out for the new CPU's coming out in Jan., I would get something like an E4500 to hold you over and save $100 on a CPU you are just going to set aside in a month.

Or alternatively, if you don't plan on getting the new CPU's right away lose the quad and get an E6750. It's cheaper and has the 1333 FSB. I don't think you are going to miss all that much with "just" a dual core, in fact I think it would be overall better. Then you can make the big purchase when the new stuff comes out and get what you really want when you are ready.

Some thoughts.... :)

[George Hallam]

Has anyone heard from Saph lately? hes not been on for a while

is you get a 8800GTX get a nice factory OC'ed one :D my BFG OC2 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814143093) model is on par with a ULTRA

[jlreich]

He hasn't been on since the 10th. Hmmmmmm, when did Crysis get released? I know he had it on pre-order for some time.

[George Hallam]

The 13th so hes probably been on that all the time :p

i really need to get it :p but i bought COD 4 and Orange box.. going out at weekends and phone credit.. when your at high school with no job its hard to get money :(

the temptation to DL it is really high but i promised myself i wouldnt

[jlreich]

I bought the Orange box a couple weeks ago and just today ordered COD4 from Newegg. :D :D

[pop pop]

Unfortunately, based on Newegg specs, the mobo is DDR3 only. I'll look at other mobos, but the Gigabyte is the schnitznit right now.

[jlreich]

OK, if the board only supports DDR3 and that's the board you are set on... :)

[saphalline]

Intel previewed the QX9770 recently. 1600 FSB, based on Penryn. Due out in Jan, along with the new X48 chipset (to replace the X38 chipset) which supports dual-CrossFire and dual-SLI.

I say wait. You've waited 4 years to replace that monster i925X-based system of yours. Wait just a bit longer if you're dead-set on Intel - which, let's face it, is the only tangible option right now! :rolleyes: Phenom's release so far has been a direct analogy to a little kid opening a gift on Xmas morning only to find a bright orange sweater knitted by grandma using the itchiest wool possible! :( The only difference is that Phenom has a chance to fix its issues while the sweater will ultimately meet an untimely death during a science experiment... ;)

Ok, here's my take on the build so far:

DDR3 is not ready for prime time. The performance just isn't on par with low-latency DDR2 unless you really know what you're doing when it comes to OC'ing and tweaking! If you don't know the difference between Tras and Tctl+ off the top of your head, your money is better spent on DDR2. Period.

The GeForce 8800 GTX is a year old. It's ancient! The only reason it is still standing as a good vid card is because 2007 was the worst #*%$ing year for graphics! R600 dragged out like a bad soap opera loose story string, then let us down with horrible AA/AF performance (seems to be AMD's trend vs their competitors this year), and don't even talk to me about Vista and DX10 and good games! The 8800 GTX is a "good" vid card right now simply because it contrasts so well with the suckiest year in recent PC gaming history!! And when the GeForce 9's are released in 6 months? You really want to show up to that fight having spent several hundred dollars on a 18-month-old vid card that can heat your living room and sucks power like your entire current system?? If you had one already, that would be one thing. But not now. Not like this. 8800 GT.

The Q6600 is a good solid CPU choice. But... it does pale in comparison to what Penryn can do. Forget the glitz and glamour surrounding Phenom and how the Q6600 is holding its own! Phenom failed, pure and simple. Not like R600, mind you (which all but dropped its pants and bent over for NVidia :rolleyes:), but Phenom did fail to topple Intel. Just because the Q6600 is beating a half-broken Phenom 9700 doesn't mean it's a wondrous CPU! Same thing here as with the vid card - it only seems "good" when compared to failures! I've seen the numbers run on Penryn, and I can tell you without a doubt that any 3 GHz+ dual-core Penryn has enough power and efficiency to crack the shiny shell of the Q6600! Penryn really is that powerful. And since Intel managed a successful shrink to 45nm, Penryn CPU's are being debuted at no less than 3 GHz! The price on these will be debatable, of course, but Intel is no fool! They're no strangers to competing with themselves in the price category! Just look at the 1333 FSB C2D's for proof of that! You want a truly awesome CPU for your high-end $3000 budget? Core 2 Duo based on Penryn.

As for the mobo, it's not stock. Intel's X38 chipset doesn't officially support the 1600 FSB. Gigabyte may have worked some magic in that area, but I'm not inclined to trust out-of-spec components unless I know how to fix problems! ;) You mentioned you were worried about Asus' BIOS issues? How about a chipset that is being run out-of-spec!? It is the X38 chipset, so it may work fine, but at what cost? It's one thing to OC by deliberately doing so. It's another thing to OC without even knowing it...

As for Vista, I have the Ultimate 64-bit version and it's pretty cool. But if I hadn't gotten it as a promotional bundle, I sure as heck would not have paid for it myself!! The extras are not really worth it, and they only add to the list of updates that need to be done. Do yourself a favor and drop down to Business 64-bit. All the same power-user features and DX10 gaming capabilities without the fluff of online poker games in Mandolin. :rolleyes: Did I mention the Business 64-bit version also supports 128GB of RAM like Ultimate 64-bit? :D

[pop pop]

OK. If I understand correctly...wait for Penryn and go with 8800GT? That'll mean waiting for a mobo also...and the only way I go Vista is 64-bit.

[pop pop]

I've spent two years out of the US. When I get back I want to build the "Ultimate" rig with a $3000 budget...same amount I spent 4 years ago.

[saphalline]

You want to give me 5% of that money... :: Jedi wave ::

It is a good investment... :: Jedi wave ::

:D :cool: :p