Hello, System Problems.. *Cries*

[angrydog]

hello guys, I built my system couple of months ago.

Go here for system Specs:
http://denuvarghese.googlepages.com/newpc

I have my PC on 24/7 and yesterday I decided to turn it off for a change and went to sleep. This morning and went and tried to turn it on, It turns on But nothing happens. The three LEDS (num lock, caps lock and scroll lock) light up then turn off and my 2 drives I have light up. Then the fancy blue LED's stay lit up too. Also I do have a water cooling system in there and that works too. But my monitor stay blank and yes it is ON. Any Idea's guys?

[Sylvander]

1. Sounds like the PC is powering on OK...
...And the POST begins OK, and gets so far as the test of the keyboard OK...
["The three LEDS (num lock, caps lock and scroll lock) light up"]...

2. "my 2 drives I have light up"
Which drives are these?
HDD?
Optical drive?
Do BOTH the LED's blink or stay unblinkingly lit?
OPTICAL
Should blink as the BIOS communicates with it during POST, then go out toward the end of POST.
HDD
Should blink [I think] as the BIOS communicates with the Controller during POST, then go out until the BIOS begins loading the OS [Windows] off the HDD, when it should blink as it reads the HDD.

3. "the fancy blue LED's stay lit up too"
I think that just shows there is power being supplied by the PSU.

4. "But my monitor stay blank and yes it is ON"
Do you normally hear a single short beep just before the display comes up on the monitor?
And are you now hearing NO single short beep?

(a) If so, that means the POST is not completing successfully.
The monitor stays blank because the BIOS is failing to succeed in initializing the video system [PCIe video card].
This at the appropriate point late in the POST just before the POST would normally end successfully and the BIOS attempt to load an OS off a disk/drive.

(b) If you ARE hearing the beep...
Has your monitor signal cable come out of its socket?
Is the PC booting all the way into Windows all unseen?

5. For guidance and information:
Sylvander’s Diagnostic Flowcharts
Download a copy of my diagnostic flowcharts from here
www.erniek.eclipse.co.uk/downloads/sylvanderdiags.zip
and print them to leaf through.
Begin on the STARTUP chart.

[angrydog]

Hey thanks for the response.


2) I was talking about the LED's on the optical drive (sorry for the confusion). I have a ASUS and a PLEXTOR. The Asus' LED's flashes and then stays ON, but my Plextor's LED's comes and stays on and then goes off.

4) I usually do hear a beep when I boot. Now I hear no Beep.




PS: Also My computer is overclocked and I wondering if I reset CMOS/take battery out; will it mess up my windows configuration to boot up?

[Sylvander]

1. "The Asus' LED's flashes and then stays ON, but my Plextor's LED's comes and stays on and then goes off"
I believe different makes of optical drive have their LED's blink in different ways under the same normal and successful communication with the BIOS.
Do you remember how they normally behaved and are they blinking in exactly the same way as normal?
The last time I paid attention, my optical drive blinked as the BIOS "Polled its hardware", and would then go out.
This would happen right in the middle of the POST.
When the drive began to go bad it would give various other LED signals, all different to the normal blinking.
But the drive going faulty, and these abnormal LED signals, although they resulted in the drive being non-functional [not enabled by the BIOS], never prevented POST from completing.

2. "I usually do hear a beep when I boot. Now I hear no Beep"
The fact you normally hear a beep means that the internal speaker was functional and probably still is.
So that's a pretty good indication that the POST is failing to complete.
One good test is to remove ALL RAM.
If you Startup with all RAM removed, the POST should...
Start, Run, Test, and when/IF it gets to the 1st RAM test, that should fail and the POST should give warning beeps to tell you of that.
That would tell us the POST got so far as the 1st RAM test, which comes shortly after the test of the keyboard controller, and shortly before the initialization of all video adapters.
I've included that section of a generic Phoenix BIOS Post below in purple, so you can see for yourself.

3. "if I reset CMOS/take battery out; will it mess up my windows configuration to boot up?"
No.
If you take the CMOS battery out, and leave it out [for the time being]...
The BIOS will use the default configuration values.
Before you do that...
You need to know whether the defaults use the PCIe video or some other [plain PCI?].
The video card you connect MUST match the setting.
If the CMOS battery is faulty and the settings have gone back to the defaults...
And PCI is the default...
That may be why your POST cannot initialize the PCIe video card. [The cause of your PC's problem]

(a) Assuming that your PCIe video card was non-functional...
And you knew that the default was PCI...
You could reset to the default [take out the CMOS battery]...
Connect a suitable PCI video card...
And Startup the PC.

4. Code_Beeps_POST Routine Description
22h 1-3-1-3 Test 8742 Keyboard Controller
24h Set ES segment register to 4 GB
28h Auto size DRAM
29h Initialize POST Memory Manager
2Ah Clear 512 kB base RAM
2Ch 1-3-4-1 RAM failure on address line xxxx*
2Eh 1-3-4-3 RAM failure on data bits xxxx* of low byte of
memory bus
2Fh Enable cache before system BIOS shadow
32h Test CPU bus-clock frequency
33h Initialize Phoenix Dispatch Manager
36h Warm start shut down
38h Shadow system BIOS ROM
3Ah Auto size cache
3Ch Advanced configuration of chipset registers
3Dh Load alternate registers with CMOS values
41h Initialize extended memory for RomPilot
42h Initialize interrupt vectors
45h POST device initialization
46h 2-1-2-3 Check ROM copyright notice
47h Initialize I20 support
48h Check video configuration against CMOS
49h Initialize PCI bus and devices
4Ah Initialize all video adapters in system

[angrydog]

Again thanks for the help. My bro just woke up and he indeed helped me build the system. he said we had the problem before and we just changed the memory to the other slot. I resetted CMOS but still no Go. I think it might be something related to memory slot gone bad??


EDIT: I just removed the memory and started it, no beeps no nothing. My brother cracked open the manual for the mother board and looked at the LED's on the motherboard (aka the D-Bracket 2). the Manual states "testing RTC (Real time clock)". COuld it be memory gone bad or the processor (thats what my bro is saying).

[Sylvander]

1. "I resetted CMOS but still no Go"
Woa, that makes it necessary to find out which type of video card is needed to match the default BIOS configuration settings, so you can provide it.

2. "I think it might be something related to memory slot gone bad?"
Could be caused by faulty RAM:
If the video BIOS...
Is being SHADOWED into RAM...
And that region of RAM is faulty...
Then the video BIOS fails to function...
And the POST cannot initialize the video, and POST halts at that point with no beeps generated.

[Sylvander]

Disconnect all RAM and also the video card...
And Startup the PC...
And see if you get any RAM failure warning beeps.

[angrydog]

Removed both RAM and video card. No beeps after I started it up.


Calling MSI Tech Support Now. Lets see if they can do anything.

[Ajmukon]

No beeps?

is the internal speaker weird up? (is there an internal speaker?)

Are you getting a number error? (either on screen or on a small LCD display in front)

[angrydog]

I do not know if there is a internal speaker, but when I regulary boot up, I do hear beeps. And the LCD screen I have up front is for the water cooling device. I removed the water cooling device and was able to hear my HDD, it sounds a little weird.

and MSI tech support just said; to dis-connect everything and connect 1 item by 1.

[Sylvander]

1. "MSI tech support just said; to dis-connect everything and connect 1 item by 1"
I had hoped to avoid that but...
Given that you get no RAM warning beeps even after you disconnect both the video card and the RAM...
And given that you have good reason to believe that the internal speaker works...
Then the next logical step is to strip back the connected hardware to the essentials only.
SO...
(a) You should have only connected:
PSU, mobo, CPU+heatsink+fan, internal speaker
...And no CMOS battery in place.
Fit a new/good one when all's well once again and you want to be able to make changes to the defaults.

(b) Ideally, the mobo would be out of the case on a non-conducting surface so as to eliminate the possibility of a short from the mobo to the case.

(c) You can use the on-switch to do its job if you trust it, otherwise use the tip of a screwdriver to manually and momentarily short the pins [on the mobo] that this switch connects to.

(d) Startup should begin, and you should then hear the beeps indicating the failure of the 1st RAM test.

(e) If you do hear them, switch off, connect the [APPROPRIATE KIND OF] video card, and Startup.
You should still hear the RAM test failure beeps.

(f) Switch off, connect a single stick of RAM in the 1st RAM slot, and Startup.
There should no longer be any RAM test failure beeps.

(g) Continue like this, adding one item at a time and see what happens.

[angrydog]

Hey I hooked up only the, mobo, psu, cpu and watercooling and the speaker..no beeps. I think It might be a bad board. And I still get the bad red light on the mobo. Either its the CPU or the mobo. Thank AGAIN SO MUCH!

[Sylvander]

Are you certain the internal speaker is functional?

If so, can you have the PSU, mobo, CPU tested?

[angrydog]

Hmm come to think of it, I think the speaker might of went dead or even the motherboard. I requested to RMA the motherboard. I still don't know what the problem is, but I have narrowed it down to the mobo and the cpu. So we'll see after I get a new mobo. Thanks for ALL the help bro and also I'll keep ya updated. My bad luck, yesterday I decided to turn the computer off for a change and today I try to turn it back on, No go.

[Sylvander]

"My bad luck, yesterday I decided to turn the computer off for a change and today I try to turn it back on, No go"
That is a very significant clue right there!

It means that the hardware functioned perfectly well just so long as you didn't attempt to re-initialize it.
That's the bit that didn't work, or failed.

So why would there be a problem with the initialization of one or more items of hardware?

SPECULATION
BIOS configuration settings no longer being suitable? [Not matched to the hardware?]

e.g. The CMOS battery went faulty, so that the settings it maintains [that deviate from the defaults] were no longer being maintained.
So the settings reverted to the defaults.
And the defaults are not a match for at least one item of hardware [the PCIe video card?]

So that perhaps you now need to fit a PCI video card?
And that will give you success?
And a display on your monitor?
So you can then go into the BIOS setup and reset the video card type to PCIe and then re-fit your PCIe video card and it will then work.

Except that doesn't explain why you get no RAM failure beeps.
Unless your speaker doesn't function.

[angrydog]

I dont have a PCI card to test, the card on this computer (my second computer) is AGP, yea i know its pre-historic :). Over night some bad omen came and didnt something :P Yeah another reason I'm just going to RMA is bec. I hear no beeps, so It had to be the mobo. Thanks again bro for helping me out, I'll stay on the forum to help others with the knowledge I have.


EDIT: My final thought was that the CMOS battery went dead and couldn't save my current config. Also I have a question after I get my new mobo, will it be all plug and play or will I have to reinstall XP. Also I do backup all my hard drives using Acronis true image. I was one thing i intended to do this build, thats why i bought the 1 TB external HDD so losing my data isnt a worry :). Again man, I can't thank you enough for the info you provided.

[mjc]

Also I have a question after I get my new mobo, will it be all plug and play or will I have to reinstall XP.

If it is a direct replacement...then there shouldn't be any problems (well, you may need to reactivate XP, but it should still work).

[Sylvander]

1. "will I have to reinstall XP"
Almost certainly you will need to run a "repair" reinstall on the Windows installation that is on your present HDD, before you make any attempt to boot the Windows installation on that HDD.
Unless, that is, your new mobo is an EXACTLY identical copy of the old mobo; the one that your present HDD was connected to when the Windows on it was installed.
Why?
Because when Windows is installed on a set of hardware, it is matched to that hardware.
That's because drivers are installed that match each item of hardware so Windows can control those items.
Then settings are entered into the registry to make those drivers work.

Then there are complicated rules that were introduced with WinXP.
WinXP is licensed to work with a particular set of hardware [a PC], and if you change enough of the hardware [a change of mobo triggers that], it's treated as if a different PC, so you must register the change within 30 days or Windows will disable itself.

2. "I do backup all my hard drives using Acronis true image"
Nice one! Good for you. :)
If your HDD had failed you'd have been OK.

[angrydog]

Alrighty thanks mjc and plenty thanks to sylvander. I'll let you know what happens when I get my new mobo. I miss playing COD4 :(, lol