Unusual thing happening for me

[alternate]

I wonder if this is a defective power supply. I've only really ever used the Seasonic S12+ model of power supply. I've never had this happen before, but inside my aluminum computer chassis is a new Seasonic power supply (since the last one smoked and burnt out; I tried turning on the computer via power button, and since it wouldn't turn on, I persisted by way of power button, eventually causing the sight and smell of electrical smoke and the end of my persistence).

Last night I touched one small piece of metal (it's a part of a hard drive connected to the computer) while it was running to feel the air temperature in the case (it was fine), but the computer immediately shut down. I was like "Sh it" and "Fu ck." I figured that I was electrically charged and that I just discharged myself onto the computer (electrically, not that other way, you pervert) (although I actually touched the aluminum chassis to ground myself as I always do). Flipping the on/off switch on the power supply didn't do anything. The LED on the motherboard was not on. I figured I just destroyed my motherboard. This isn't the case, since later that night the LED on motherboard returned to life spontaneously and apparently computer was again operational.

Earlier just now, I turned off the computer and installed a case fan to help air temperature (reducing NB and CPU temp by about 14 and 17 C, respectively). What I noticed is that the same nonresponsiveness happened as last night! I couldn't turn it on, and the motherboard LED was not lit! "Sh.." and "Fu...", less intensely. Shorter a while later than the while last night returns the motherboard LED (this time I witnessed a blinkering of it before returning to life definitely). The computer was off, but the power supply switch was on, and the light on motherboard was on during fan installation (at least until some point; i didn't suspect it would happen again and didn't pay attention.)

This happened maybe 10 minutes ago, and everything seems normal except for what just happened!

Who has ideas on what happened?

[alternate]

My thoughts are:

i.) this motherboard is more sensitive than the others to electrical charge in the atmosphere; and so in each case I discharged myself, and motherboard felt it.

ii.) this power supply takes the role of the motherboard in i.) above. i personally think this is more likely than i.) as on the fan installation while computer was off, i only really touched the molex four-pin power cable, and actually i didn't even touch any metal.

iii.) my battery backup unit is responsible somehow. i suspect this since last time the power supply died, it was connected through the battery back up; behavior with an intermediate power supply (before new seasonic arrived and was installed) was not completely normal, as despite windows and bios settings, pressing power button would just turn off the computer immediately. See here (http://pcguide.com/vb/showthread.php?t=62696). That behavior of immediate shut off stopped when I took my computer home to my parents and plugged in without a battery backup.

i feel uneasy thinking that my computer is unstable and in greater danger. i want to get this resolved. any ideas, anyone?

[PrntRhd]

Although I don't think the battery backup is causing this, I agree with dividing the potential areas of concern until the cause is isolated (basic troubleshooting).

[alternate]

I found a probable cause of my problems. In the room where I have my computer plugged in, the wall outlets have only two connectors and no third round ground connector. So, I think the computer was electrically charged the entire time, so when I touched my computer (while I was grounded) its charge was transferred to me, causing unexpected things to happen. The instance when the first power supply died was probably due to a nonneutral charge on the power supply. So, yes, my choice of UPS as a problem was the most accurate, I think; it's not the UPS's problem per se but the power it gives to the computer from the wall.

[Paul Komski]

General Point. A PSU should always be earthed whether via a UPS or whether attached to the mains supply directly. Period. Double period if you have a metal case into which the PSU is screwed. This is for your own, and to some extent your computer's, safety and also allows any static to be drained immediately to earth if the case is touched. The static will drain in this way even if the switch at the wall is turned off because the earth connection is not broken - unless the plug is physically pulled out.

An earth leakage current detector (a special contact breaker) at the main fuse box is an additional safety feature.

[FTT]

An earth leakage current detector

Are you referring to what is known as a GFCI (http://pkpoweronline.com/images/GFCI_Electrical_Outlets.jpg) = Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter? They can be located at the breaker panel or at the outlet and are also available on some electrical cords.

[Paul Komski]

I had actually meant what seems to be more technically called a Residual Current Circuit Breaker (http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/andeligroup/offer-detailugfJnKQHjEzS/Sell-Hager-Residual-Current-Circuit-Breaker-Hager-.html) that work, as I understand it, by measuring the current in against the current out and if they don't match trip the switch on the assumption that the excess had drained to earth elsewhere. The one in my own home is directly beside the main mains switch.

[mjc]

I think part of the problem is US/Europe requirements/specs and terminology...

Back to alternate's problem, though...

If the outlets are the older two prong ones and there isn't a separate grounding/earthing connector, and there is a problem, then it isn't just relegated to computer/UPC...it is a much bigger problem with the wiring in general. You only 'need' two wires to make current flow...the hot and the neutral. Before the advent of the third prong, all grounding was done through the neutral...if there isn't an adequate ground, then something is really wrong.

[jlreich]

Do get your electricity checked out. I often charge customers for the service call when I get anything over 0.02v on the ground. Anything above that is really not tolerable for computers. Also I will not fix the system until the outlet is fixed, and then they get charged for fixing it when I come back. Actually I am supposed to charge them if I get any voltage over the ground.

On another note a lot of our customers use a UPS. I have seen many problems like yours caused by a bad or going bad UPS. The easiest way to troubleshot is how you have already done, remove it form the UPS and plug it straight in to a known good outlet. If it works fine that way, then you plug it back into the UPS and problem returns you have your culprit.

But it does sound like you may have a combination of several potential problems that you need to get checked out. PSU, UPS, and electricity. One or all of these can cause your problems. Bad electricity can damage the other two, as can a bad UPS damage the PSU.

I would check all of them out before you proceed with the computer hardware. Once you have those sorted out you can go on with seeing if any of the components have been damaged. Hopefully not.

This could also simply be caused by a bad power switch. Jump the pins on the motherboard to check that out.

[alternate]

Thanks, jlreich and mjc and komski; that was very cool.

The UPS's red light is on, indicating 'wiring fault.' If i plug in a separate surge protector, the leds indicate that there is no ground. In both cases, they are not connected directly into the wall, as the wall only receives 2-prong connector. So I actually took an extension and chopped off the middle thing and use it in the obvious way. As mjc said, though, one of the 2 connectors is ground anyway. This extension-cord-chop-off idea i use doesn't contribute to problem, right (after all, there is no third-ground prong input to make use of anyway)?

Is there a type of separate grounding device I can just 'attach,' and ta-da bypass the stupid house's ground problem (or perhaps it's just my problem that the house happens to be caught in)? By the way, how do you measure the voltage on the ground?

[FTT]

Upgrading the wiring in the house is the best and safest way but you could also just run one 'dedicated' outlet and line to where you want your computer all the way from the fusebox / circuit breaker panel properly wired to include ground.

Either way requires a licensed electrician.

The only other way I am aware of is to use a grounding adapter (http://www.electronicplus.com/images/products/419GY.jpg) and screwing the little tab to the box. This will only work IF the house used metal jacketed wiring and not the cloth type anywhere along the way to the outlet you are plugged into. Otherwise it will do nothing at all to help you.