PC shuts down randomly. Need Help!

[mdq]

Hi, about a month ago my pc started shutting down randomly. It can happen up to 3 or 4 times in the same day and at least once every day.

I have already tried swapping the power supply. Temperatures seem fine: 32º for the cpu and 50º for the graphics card.

Fans also seem to be working ok. I already cleaned all the dust. I even checked the ram by swapping them and by testing them with memtest.

Ultimately, I formatted the hard drive thinking that it could be a windows problem but that didn´t work either.

PC is a Core 2 duo 1.8 Hgz, 2GB Ram, Nvidia GeForce 8500 GT. MSI mother

I need help ´cause I have run out of ideas and it´s driving me nuts. I need it to work and it´s really hard to do anything.

Thanks

[Paul Komski]

Which Operating System and Service Pack?
Does it happen in Safe Mode?

Faulty drivers or other software would come high on my list of culprits. Does it happen, as far as you are aware, when using any particular applications.

WINDOWS XP SHUTDOWN & RESTART TROUBLESHOOTING (http://www.aumha.org/win5/a/shtdwnxp.php)

Read the above and see if there are any logs/dumps that can help with the diagnosis.

[mdq]

Hi Paul. I have Windows XP service pack 3. As I said, I made a clean install to discard software possibilities.

The pc was also checked by a friend of mine who is a technician and he couldn´t find anything wrong either. It only shutted down once while he was testing it with a videogame.

Regarding drivers, I downloaded the latest drivers I could find online. I even flashed the bios.

I can´t tell for sure about applications. I mean, it has shuted down while using photoshop or a 3D software, but also while watching a video from the internet.

Also whenever it shuts down, it restarts inmediately and shows no errors at all

I´ll check your link now. Thanks for the help.

[nuz]

Bad caps? Check whether the electrolytics around the processor are OK

[Paul Komski]

Also whenever it shuts down, it restarts inmediately and shows no errors at allWhat shows no errors.

A reboot is a different kettle of fish than a shutdown - as the aumha link should have indicated. Usually random reboots are associated with a BSOD even if it wasn't obvious to the user. The distinction between hardware and software can be blurred particularly when it comes to drivers but many BSODs are due to driver-related problems.

You need to examine the logs and/or minidumps (if BSODs) to help get a handle on troubleshooting the problem.

If you get no reboots in SafeMode you can be pretty sure it is a software related problem.

[mdq]

Sorry Paul. I´m no expert in this matter so maybe I didn´t made myself clear enough.

I meant that if I check the log for errors (Start > Run and type: eventvwr.msc /s) I don´t see an error at the time of the shutdown.

I will try to describe exactly what happens. I could be watching a video or using any software or doing anything at all.

Then, PC shuts down (off, like pulling the plug) and the fans stop as if there´s no electricity and instantly goes on again like it was just turned on.

No blue screen, no freezes, no event viewer report. Just off and on again like nothing happened.

I have tried anything could find with no luck so far. I still haven´t tried the safemode. I guess I´ll try that now

[classicsoftware]

There is one common thread that runs through your post. You are stressing the video card when it shuts down. This is either:


A heat issues with the fan or heat sink on the video card
A bad video card on the motherboard if it's on board video
A corrupted video card driver.


I would concentrate my efforts in that area.

[mdq]

classicsoftware:

the videocard is a Nvidia geforce 8500 GT PCI express 512MB.

I´ve also installed the latest driver from the Nvidia page.

Dual core center reports 50º temperature. The fan is running ok

Not sure how to check the items you mention though

[mdq]

Here I´ve found the video card model:

http://www.msi.com/index.php?func=proddesc&maincat_no=130&cat2_no=136&prod_no=1198#

[Sylvander]

How to solve Windows system crashes in minutes (http://www.networkworld.com/news/2005/041105-windows-crash.html?page=1).

[classicsoftware]

Open the case and look at the video card and see if he fan is spinning. If it is not spinning, you have your answer.

Also, you can try to swap the video card out and see if that is the problem.

[Paul Komski]

There may not be any reports in event viewer but you could check to see when there last was a Dr Watson log (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/308538) produced.

One thing does strike me and it is, of course, what makes troubleshooting harder and that is the very random nature of the problem. Very random events can sometimes be caused by power dips - either due to a poor PSU or to loose cabling/connections to any of your drives in particular. So if this continues to be elusive it is another area to consider.

[mdq]

classicsoftware,

the case is open and the fan is spinning properly. Also the heat sink isn´t hot at all.

[mdq]

Paul,

Yesterday I spent the hole afternoon until late night working on a proyect using painter X and photoshop and had no problem at all. Today, I watched a movie and later it shutted down while watching a trailer on the internet.

How do I check the Dr Watson log you mention? I found a log file but don´t know what to look for

[mdq]

guys,

while looking for "troubleshoot video card" in google, I came across this program called Prime 95 that runs torture tests for CPU and RAM.

I´ve found out that if I run the one called "In-place large FFTs (maximum heat, power consumption, some RAM tested)" Pc shuts down every single time. In fact it shutted down 3 out of 3 times I´ve done it.

Don´t know if this gives you any hint. Maybe it´s my CPU that´s ruined? And yet Pc works perfect until the shutdown.

[Paul Komski]

Heat and RAM seem to be the most common culprits with Prime 95. Maybe check-out their forums (http://www.mersenneforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=10) and even post your problem there.

I would also go into the BIOS and reset to failsafe defaults.

Note the date when the DrWatson log was created then open the log (open with notepad or other text editor) and search back from the end of the file till you find the start of that entry. There should be a lot of debug info that will be pretty meaningless at first but the date of when this happened is of prime concern. If it was before all your recent problems it is probably not relevant. If the log keeps getting added-to with each crash then more detailed examination would be appropriate.

[classicsoftware]

Are you over clocking?

[mdq]

No, I´m not overclocking. I`ve been using it for about a year and a half now and I never even messed with the bios settings.

[nuz]

Did you check the electrolytics around the CPU?

[classicsoftware]

Swap out the video card first....

[mdq]

Already did the swapping thing. I couldn´t swap neither the processor nor the mother ´cause I couldn´t get one.

Other than that I already swapped power supply and RAM. As I said, original RAM was tested with memtest. I left it for more than 10 hours straight without an error.

Thanks for all the help guys. Really. I can´t believe this **** is so hard to spot. I´ll keep on checking

[classicsoftware]

If you swapped out the video card, then you are down to the RAM, CPU or MOBO.

[Paul Komski]

Which MSI board is this? A replacement CPU for it might be findable (though you say not) and since stressing the system has consistently recreated your problem it might indicate that as the problem item, since you 'appear' to have excluded RAM as the culprit. Have you actually disassembled the CPU from the mobo and reassembled after cleaning?

I know you have previously swapped the PSU but do double-check that all its connections (particularly any molex connections) are good and tight.

I agree that it looks more and more like hardware than software but you didn't let us know if the date of the Dr Watson log makes it of any relevance or not.

When fundamental hardware becomes suspect it can often be worth biting the bullet and grabbing a new barebones or upgrade kit (or indeed more up-market components if budget is not a huge issue) to try to eliminate any (even literal) headaches you may be getting. One other possible, even if unlikely, faulty component could be the hard drive - certainly worth testing with its maker's diagnostics - though a bad cold solder joint is yet another outsider.

[mdq]

Mother is MSI P965 Neo-F V2.I lnow a replacement CPU might be findable. It´s just that the technician couldn´t find one yet.

I have excluded RAm modules as the culprit, because I tested them with memtest, I swapped them for another two modules (currently I´m using two OCZ DDR2 PC2-4200) and also tried using just one to see if it was a compatibility problem.

Also the technician tried another hard drive. Maybe it´s the motherboard although it looks brand new. No inflated caps, no burning, not a scratch at all.

[mdq]

Just checked the drWatson log here´s the last part of it, although I don´t have the slightest clue of what it means or it is has any relevance at all because I don´t now how to read it. I apologize if I´m posting it the wrong way:

*----> Seguimiento regresivo de pila <----*
WARNING: Stack unwind information not available. Following frames may be wrong.
*** ERROR: Symbol file could not be found. Defaulted to export symbols for C:\WINDOWS\system32\QtCore4.dll -
ChildEBP RetAddr Args to Child
1a62ff18 7c802542 00000848 ffffffff 00000000 ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet
1a62ff2c 670152bf 00000848 ffffffff 0854b898 kernel32!WaitForSingleObject+0x12
0854b90c 0ea67408 00000002 0ea67428 0ea67448 QtCore4!QWaitCondition__wait+0x4f
0ea673d0 0ea67328 671dc514 00000000 00030004 0xea67408
0ea673e8 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000814 0xea67328

*----> Muestra de pilas sin procesar <----*
000000001a62feb4 3c df 91 7c db 25 80 7c - 48 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 <..|.%.|H.......
000000001a62fec4 00 00 00 00 10 b9 54 08 - 80 7a a6 0e 00 ff ff ff ......T..z......
000000001a62fed4 14 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
000000001a62fee4 10 00 00 00 ac 7a a6 0e - 00 00 00 00 00 e0 fd 7f .....z..........
000000001a62fef4 00 70 f4 7f 00 00 00 00 - 03 00 00 00 c8 fe 62 1a .p............b.
000000001a62ff04 00 00 00 00 9c ff 62 1a - c0 9a 83 7c 08 26 80 7c ......b....|.&.|
000000001a62ff14 00 00 00 00 2c ff 62 1a - 42 25 80 7c 48 08 00 00 ....,.b.B%.|H...
000000001a62ff24 ff ff ff ff 00 00 00 00 - 0c b9 54 08 bf 52 01 67 ..........T..R.g
000000001a62ff34 48 08 00 00 ff ff ff ff - 98 b8 54 08 ff ff ff ff H.........T.....
000000001a62ff44 10 b9 54 08 a0 12 01 67 - dd 1d 1d 18 00 b9 54 08 ..T....g......T.
000000001a62ff54 ff ff ff ff 18 72 a6 0e - 88 74 a6 0e ac ff 62 1a .....r...t....b.
000000001a62ff64 b8 0e 9e 0e 88 74 a6 0e - 71 44 01 67 48 07 cb 04 .....t..qD.gH...
000000001a62ff74 00 00 cb 04 bb 29 13 78 - 88 74 a6 0e ea 4b 1f 95 .....).x.t...K..
000000001a62ff84 48 07 cb 04 00 00 cb 04 - b8 0e 9e 0e 80 ff 62 1a H.............b.
000000001a62ff94 80 ff 62 1a dc ff 62 1a - dc ff 62 1a d9 8c 13 78 ..b...b...b....x
000000001a62ffa4 fe ff 66 f7 00 00 00 00 - ec ff 62 1a 47 2a 13 78 ..f.......b.G*.x
000000001a62ffb4 00 00 cb 04 13 b7 80 7c - b8 0e 9e 0e 48 07 cb 04 .......|....H...
000000001a62ffc4 00 00 cb 04 b8 0e 9e 0e - 00 70 f4 7f 00 76 5f 8a .........p...v_.
000000001a62ffd4 c0 ff 62 1a 00 eb ec 89 - ff ff ff ff c0 9a 83 7c ..b............|
000000001a62ffe4 20 b7 80 7c 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ..|............

*----> Estado para identificador de subproceso 0xa68 <----*

eax=781329e1 ebx=ffffff00 ecx=00000000 edx=0012d4a8 esi=00000854 edi=00000000
eip=7c91e4f4 esp=1a72feb4 ebp=1a72ff18 iopl=0 nv up ei pl zr na po nc
cs=001b ss=0023 ds=0023 es=0023 fs=003b gs=0000 efl=00000246

función: ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet
7c91e4da e829000000 call ntdll!RtlRaiseException (7c91e508)
7c91e4df 8b0424 mov eax,[esp]
7c91e4e2 8be5 mov esp,ebp
7c91e4e4 5d pop ebp
7c91e4e5 c3 ret
7c91e4e6 8da42400000000 lea esp,[esp]
7c91e4ed 8d4900 lea ecx,[ecx]
ntdll!KiFastSystemCall:
7c91e4f0 8bd4 mov edx,esp
7c91e4f2 0f34 sysenter
ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet:
7c91e4f4 c3 ret
7c91e4f5 8da42400000000 lea esp,[esp]
7c91e4fc 8d642400 lea esp,[esp]
ntdll!KiIntSystemCall:
7c91e500 8d542408 lea edx,[esp+0x8]
7c91e504 cd2e int 2e
7c91e506 c3 ret
7c91e507 90 nop
ntdll!RtlRaiseException:
7c91e508 55 push ebp
7c91e509 8bec mov ebp,esp

*----> Seguimiento regresivo de pila <----*
WARNING: Stack unwind information not available. Following frames may be wrong.
ChildEBP RetAddr Args to Child
1a72ff18 7c802542 00000854 ffffffff 00000000 ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet
1a72ff2c 670152bf 00000854 ffffffff 0854b898 kernel32!WaitForSingleObject+0x12
0854b90c 0ea67408 00000002 0ea67428 0ea67448 QtCore4!QWaitCondition__wait+0x4f
0ea673d0 0ea67328 671dc514 00000000 00030004 0xea67408
0ea673e8 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000814 0xea67328

*----> Muestra de pilas sin procesar <----*
000000001a72feb4 3c df 91 7c db 25 80 7c - 54 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 <..|.%.|T.......
000000001a72fec4 00 00 00 00 10 b9 54 08 - a8 7b a6 0e 00 ff ff ff ......T..{......
000000001a72fed4 14 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
000000001a72fee4 10 00 00 00 05 00 00 00 - 01 00 00 00 00 e0 fd 7f ................
000000001a72fef4 00 60 f4 7f 00 00 00 00 - 05 00 00 00 c8 fe 72 1a .`............r.
000000001a72ff04 01 00 00 00 9c ff 72 1a - c0 9a 83 7c 08 26 80 7c ......r....|.&.|
000000001a72ff14 00 00 00 00 2c ff 72 1a - 42 25 80 7c 54 08 00 00 ....,.r.B%.|T...
000000001a72ff24 ff ff ff ff 00 00 00 00 - 0c b9 54 08 bf 52 01 67 ..........T..R.g
000000001a72ff34 54 08 00 00 ff ff ff ff - 98 b8 54 08 ff ff ff ff T.........T.....
000000001a72ff44 10 b9 54 08 a0 12 01 67 - dd 1d 1d 18 00 b9 54 08 ..T....g......T.
000000001a72ff54 ff ff ff ff 50 75 a6 0e - 18 75 a6 0e ac ff 72 1a ....Pu...u....r.
000000001a72ff64 e8 75 a6 0e 18 75 a6 0e - 71 44 01 67 48 07 cb 04 .u...u..qD.gH...
000000001a72ff74 00 00 cb 04 bb 29 13 78 - 18 75 a6 0e ea 4b 0f 95 .....).x.u...K..
000000001a72ff84 48 07 cb 04 00 00 cb 04 - e8 75 a6 0e 80 ff 72 1a H........u....r.
000000001a72ff94 80 ff 72 1a dc ff 72 1a - dc ff 72 1a d9 8c 13 78 ..r...r...r....x
000000001a72ffa4 fe ff 66 f7 00 00 00 00 - ec ff 72 1a 47 2a 13 78 ..f.......r.G*.x
000000001a72ffb4 00 00 cb 04 13 b7 80 7c - e8 75 a6 0e 48 07 cb 04 .......|.u..H...
000000001a72ffc4 00 00 cb 04 e8 75 a6 0e - 00 60 f4 7f 00 76 5f 8a .....u...`...v_.
000000001a72ffd4 c0 ff 72 1a f8 d5 40 8a - ff ff ff ff c0 9a 83 7c ..r...@........|
000000001a72ffe4 20 b7 80 7c 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ..|............

*----> Estado para identificador de subproceso 0xb08 <----*

eax=000000c0 ebx=00000000 ecx=00000000 edx=7ffddc00 esi=00000000 edi=00000000
eip=7c91e4f4 esp=1cf5ff9c ebp=1cf5ffb4 iopl=0 nv up ei pl zr na po nc
cs=001b ss=0023 ds=0023 es=0023 fs=003b gs=0000 efl=00000246

función: ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet
7c91e4da e829000000 call ntdll!RtlRaiseException (7c91e508)
7c91e4df 8b0424 mov eax,[esp]
7c91e4e2 8be5 mov esp,ebp
7c91e4e4 5d pop ebp
7c91e4e5 c3 ret
7c91e4e6 8da42400000000 lea esp,[esp]
7c91e4ed 8d4900 lea ecx,[ecx]
ntdll!KiFastSystemCall:
7c91e4f0 8bd4 mov edx,esp
7c91e4f2 0f34 sysenter
ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet:
7c91e4f4 c3 ret
7c91e4f5 8da42400000000 lea esp,[esp]
7c91e4fc 8d642400 lea esp,[esp]
ntdll!KiIntSystemCall:
7c91e500 8d542408 lea edx,[esp+0x8]
7c91e504 cd2e int 2e
7c91e506 c3 ret
7c91e507 90 nop
ntdll!RtlRaiseException:
7c91e508 55 push ebp
7c91e509 8bec mov ebp,esp

*----> Seguimiento regresivo de pila <----*
WARNING: Stack unwind information not available. Following frames may be wrong.
ChildEBP RetAddr Args to Child
1cf5ffb4 7c80b713 00000000 00000000 00000000 ntdll!KiFastSystemCallRet
1cf5ffec 00000000 7c937ebb 00000000 00000000 kernel32!GetModuleFileNameA+0x1b4

*----> Muestra de pilas sin procesar <----*
000000001cf5ff9c fc d1 91 7c 02 7f 93 7c - 01 00 00 00 ac ff f5 1c ...|...|........
000000001cf5ffac 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 80 - ec ff f5 1c 13 b7 80 7c ...............|
000000001cf5ffbc 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
000000001cf5ffcc 00 50 f4 7f 00 76 5f 8a - c0 ff f5 1c f8 52 f6 89 .P...v_......R..
000000001cf5ffdc ff ff ff ff c0 9a 83 7c - 20 b7 80 7c 00 00 00 00 .......| ..|....
000000001cf5ffec 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - bb 7e 93 7c 00 00 00 00 .........~.|....
000000001cf5fffc 00 00 00 00 00 00 e1 1e - 00 00 2e 1d 00 00 00 00 ................
000000001cf6000c 00 00 00 00 00 10 11 00 - 00 10 11 00 10 04 00 00 ................
000000001cf6001c 00 0b 00 00 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6002c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6003c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6004c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6005c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6006c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6007c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6008c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf6009c 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf600ac 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf600bc 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................
000000001cf600cc 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff - 80 80 80 ff 80 80 80 ff ................

[mdq]

One last thing. A minute ago after it shutted down, I unplugged the video card once more and while attempting to clean the heat sink and the fan I notticed that the thermal grease isn´t like the one in the processor.

This one looks like crystallized or something. Not transparent, but completely dry and hard. It seems like glued to the chip.

The one in the CPU, however it´s a bit dry too but not as this one.

Don´t know it this is of any relevance either.

[mdq]

I think I found it.

In the BIOS settings, under ADVANCED BIOS/ CORE MULTI-PROCESSING, I switched to disable and now I´ve been able to run Prime 95 without the PC shutting off and rendered a file at the same time.

Also I noticed that the cpu temperature that used to rise from 32/ 34º up to 48/ 49º whenever I started the test, now is stable at 40º while testing and rendering.

So I guess is the CPU that´s screwed.

[mdq]

Someone recommended using Speedfan to check for temps. I also compared the values with Everest and both show the same.

I´m posting a screenshot ´cause they don´t look so good. Values were taken with one core disabled.


http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/7349/speedfanonecore.jpg