VirtualBox

[FrankSG]

My OS is win7 home premium 64 bit. I'm thinking about downloading VirtualBox. I have a legal copy of Win98 that I want to install. Will 98 install using virtualbox or does it have to be xp? Also, has anyone used virtualbox and if so, how do you like it? Thanks, ~Frank~

[Paul Komski]

There is a huge range of both host and guest operating system compatibilities.

Win7 is fine as a host on which Win98 (along with many others (http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Guest_OSes)) should install just fine. If not then you will have lost very little apart from the time in downloading and so on.

I have used the MS VM and not the one from Sun but jlreich certainly has experience of i (http://www.pcguide.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73504)t.

[123456]

Virtualbox is pretty neat. I had 98 on it for a while and it ran fine.

[FrankSG]

I just now installed MS Virtual PC 2007. I'm not going to put Win98 on it yet. I think I can get a legal copy of XP. If I can, I'll install it. Thanks...

[jlreich]

If you want you can install 98 until you get a copy of XP. One of the beautiful things about VM's is you can have as many as you want. Even run them concurrently if you like, assuming you have enough hardware for it.

I am a fan of VirtualBox because it has more capabilities than MS VPC, the most important for me is the ability to run 64bit OS's and that it is cross platform so works in both windows and Linux, but MS VPC works just fine.

Actually there are some instances where MS is better. Like running certain Linux Live CD/DVD ISO image files from my hard drive (yep, don't even need to burn it to disk to try it :cool: ). VB can run some of them but choke on others. MS VPC chokes on some but has more success in this particular area. But then again VB has been updated quite a bit since I have tried doing that with it. Will probably give it a go again to see if it has gotten better.

Actually dug out my win98 disk after talking about it in the thread Paul linked to, but it seems it is no longer any good. Have a 95 disk as well, but fear it may be bad also since it was stored right next to the 98 disk.

[FrankSG]

This brings up another question. The win98 CD that I have is one that I bought from Staples shortly after 98 came out. Since MS no longer supports 98, doesn't this mean that I can no longer get security updates; and if this is so, would I be at risk for all kinds of mal-ware?

[123456]

Run Windows Update after you install, and use a good firewall, (personally I use the last freeware version of Kerio for 9x)... I know this is a horrible habit, but I don't use anti-spyware software on my 9x computers, cause I'm pretty confident that my router's built-in firewall takes care of it.

[FrankSG]

Run Windows Update after you install,
Glad to hear that I can run the Windows Update. I always thought that once MS discontinued support, you could no longer get updates from them. So if I can still get updates, what do they mean when they say that support is discontinued?

[PrntRhd]

So if I can still get updates, what do they mean when they say that support is discontinued?
It means Microsoft will not write any newer patches for that discontinued OS, so if new security problems arise, at that point you are on your own.

That is what Classicsoftware has been saying about WIN98 not being safe to use on the Internet, you would be exposed to recent exploits and your OS is no longer up to date for patches to stop those.

[jlreich]

If it is running in a VM just don't enable file sharing with the host computer and you should be fine. Also you can enable "undo disks" and choose to revert system state when you want to close it if you think it may have become infected.

Was just trying to install 98 in Sun VB and could not. Kept running into "out of MS DOS range" errors. Installing in MS VPC right now without any issues. Edit - Actually getting some issues now. Once 98 was installed it doesn't seem to want to recognize the CD in the drive which causes issues when it tries to install drivers. Changed the CD-ROM setting in VPC and am going to try it again. 2nd edit - OK all is good now. When it prompted me to remove the floppy disk for the first restart I also removed the CD. Not supposed to do that! Wow! It's been a long time. :D

By the way, it has been a looooooong time since I have installed win9x. My disk is good I just forgot most 9x disks are not bootable. :p Had to download a win98 floppy image (http://s93616405.onlinehome.us/bootdisk/win98sc.zip) (direct link) and do the whole fdisk and format thing. Wow! What a trip down memory lane. :D

[Fruss Tray Ted]

Frank,
What do you plan to do with Win98? There's no longer any A/V companies supporting it with updates either so surfing the net is like waterskiing in shark infested waters...

If all you want it for is legacy hardware or for the games, there's other options.

[FrankSG]

Frank,
What do you plan to do with Win98? There's no longer any A/V companies supporting it with updates either so surfing the net is like waterskiing in shark infested waters...

If all you want it for is legacy hardware or for the games, there's other options.

My scanner won't run on my 64bit machine. It's an old scanner and drivers are not available. I have two and I have two older programs that won't run. So that's the only reason I would use it for. I definitely won't go on the internet. As a matter-of-fact, when I'm using it, I may disconnect the cable from my modem so that I don't need to worry about any mal-ware.

[FrankSG]

Fruss Tray--I forgot to ask you: What are the other options for running my older programs. As far as my scanner is concerned, it's no problem since my Netbook is 32bit, I can use it to run my scanner. But the two older programs I have need to have the CD inserted to run them; and the netbook has on CD drive. But, I got to thinking about it, the two older programs that I can't run are not really that important, so instead of messing around with VM, I might just forget about it. I haven't installed the win98 yet and I'm not sure if I want to. I'll have to do more studying on Win7 Compatibility feature.

[jlreich]

I definitely won't go on the internet. As a matter-of-fact, when I'm using it, I may disconnect the cable from my modem so that I don't need to worry about any mal-ware.
No reason for that, just go to the VM settings and turn off the network adapter for the VM by choosing "none" and it won't have access to the internet.

If you just need it for the scanner then I wouldn't bother with 98. It is more work than it is worth in my opinion. I been having some fun getting it going in a VM but it hasn't been exactly plug and play because it is so out of date. Wait until you get a copy of XP. XP should be much easier to get going than 98. Though my copy of 98 is FE, if you have the SE version it might be a little better. Either way it can be done if you don't want to or can't find a copy of XP.

[FrankSG]

Yes--I think I'm just going to leave well-enough-alone. Everything is running just right now and I have a clean system. I'll run my scanner with my netbook. The other two are not that important. I might be able to get a legal copy of XP. If so, I might install it. On the other hand, I may just forget about it. As I mentioned on the above post, I'm going to look into the win7 compatibility feature.

[risk_reversal]

I am sure that someone will correct me if I am in error, but also note the following re Folder Sharing, (section 4.6 of VB manual).

4.6. Folder sharing
In order to use this feature, the VirtualBox Guest Additions have to be installed. Note however that Shared Folders are only supported with Windows (2000 or newer), Linux and Solaris guests

Folder sharing works fine with XP or 2000 guest.

So in essence, if you scanned images in the guest and wanted to transfer them to the host, you would need to use a USB device to transfer them from the guest (unless you emailed them to yourself).

Good Luck

[jlreich]

I am sure that is correct. I have never tried shared folders in 98. Only installed it for fun.

[123456]

I think Shared Folders for 98 works in Virtual PC 2007.

[jlreich]

Just tried it and you are right 123456. Worked just fine in MS VPC.

[Fruss Tray Ted]

Frank,
For your netbook you could install a 'virtual drive' and you will be able to load the CD's by first copying them to your main pc and putting them onto a memory stick to transfer to the netbook. Then run the Virtual drive to operate the software that you have.

I have an older version of Farstone's Virtual Drive and it mentions that it can be used even without a CD-ROM drive as is your case. There are other virtual drives out there, some free some pay here (http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&source=hp&q=virtual+drive&btnG=Google+Search). 'Magiciso' looks promising as a freebie.

[FrankSG]

Frank,
For your netbook you could install a 'virtual drive' and you will be able to load the CD's by first copying them to your main pc and putting them onto a memory stick to transfer to the netbook. Then run the Virtual drive to operate the software that you have.

I have an older version of Farstone's Virtual Drive and it mentions that it can be used even without a CD-ROM drive as is your case. There are other virtual drives out there, some free some pay here (http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&source=hp&q=virtual+drive&btnG=Google+Search). 'Magiciso' looks promising as a freebie.
Thanks, Fruss--I'll look into that.

[123456]

You could make an ISO of your 98 CD on a desktop and copy it to your netbook via flash drive.

[Paul Komski]

Thanks for the heads up regarding Virtual Drives FrussTrayTed.

I haven't used it in a while (but may be about to again since I have just obtained a NetBook of my own) but DaemonTools was the application I liked best in the past for use as a Virtual Optical Drive. The Lite version is free (http://www.daemon-tools.cc/eng/downloads) for non-commercial use; the other two versions are trialware. If memory serves it would recognise quite a wide range of CD/DVD image files including .iso files as well as Nero images, etc.

There are a lot of apps for creating iso images including the brilliant Iso-Buster (http://www.smart-projects.net/cdrecovery.php) (as well as ImgBurn (http://www.imgburn.com/)) as long as you are not attempting to overcome copy protected DVDs etc.

[jlreich]

I have been using Virtual Cone Drive (http://www.slysoft.com/en/virtual-clonedrive.html) for a couple years. It is updated periodically, free, and from a reputable company. No crapware, bloatware, or malware like some other virtual drives I have tried. I actually use it to play DVD ISO's of my backed up DVD's. It also will emulate a BD-ROM.

[FrankSG]

Every time I think I know it all, I learn something new.:) This is all very interesting.

[Fruss Tray Ted]

I have been using Virtual Cone Drive (http://www.slysoft.com/en/virtual-clonedrive.html) for a couple years. It is updated periodically, free, and from a reputable company. No crapware, bloatware, or malware like some other virtual drives I have tried. I actually use it to play DVD ISO's of my backed up DVD's. It also will emulate a BD-ROM.

Frank,
You're not alone... ;) :p

jlreich,
What is BD? Blue Ray Disk? Heck I'm just beginning to use a DVD-RAM!?! :o And I still use a Super-Sharpie to write the info on my burned disks, even when I have a LightScribe burner!! :o :o

I am unaware of any malware on the virtual rom I've used or any I've read about but the ones that catch my eye are usually by a reputable known company so I tend to trust them. And yes, I recognize the SlySoft name. Good call. I've only actually needed a CD drive emulator when I was using an older handheld GPS unit with live link to my laptop and I did not want to use the optical drive in the laptop sitting on the truck seat because I wanted to conserve 'juice' (and have the ability to listen to music or even burn CD's). So I installed the software and put the 2 GPS programs into iso's (Magellan's MapSend and DeLorme's TopoUSA). Worked great! But nowadays my GPS units use SD cards, so the reason for the virtual drive is almost moot in a laptop but very useful in a netbook.

I don't tend to use an emulator for viewing the DVD's I've burned or duplicated using DVD Shrink (http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&source=hp&q=DVD+Shrink&btnG=Google+Search), because it puts the .vob and other files onto the hard drive prior to compressing them and I usually just go to that folder and watch them from HDD with VLC, or Media Player Classic. Sometimes even WMP. It seems I find one is better at skipping around to various areas of the video, or others handle different file-types more smoothly. Some you can de/in/crease the play speed, others better for still frames captures and setting editing points.

No,, Frank,,, It's boring! ;) That's why we all do it!! :D

[jlreich]

What is BD? Blue Ray Disk?
Yep. I don't do Blu-ray yet either, but thought it a good feature to point out to others that are.

I don't tend to use an emulator for viewing the DVD's I've burned or duplicated using DVD Shrink, because it puts the .vob and other files onto the hard drive prior to compressing them and I usually just go to that folder and watch them from HDD with VLC, or Media Player Classic. Sometimes even WMP. It seems I find one is better at skipping around to various areas of the video, or others handle different file-types more smoothly. Some you can de/in/crease the play speed, others better for still frames captures and setting editing points.
I haven't used DVDShrink for years because it hasn't been updated for three years or more. I use the combo of AnyDVD and CloneDVD both from Slysoft. Though I know there are a bunch of people that use AnyDVD and DVDShrink combo instead of paying for CloneDVD. But I bought the lifetime license for both apps a couple years ago. Even got the Blu-ray/HD plug-in for AnyDVD last year before the price went up on the lifetime so I am all ready for when I do go HDTV. Just waiting for the BD-ROM's to drop in price a little more and will start getting Blu-Ray versions. Actually for the movies that have the BD disk set that includes the DVD version for a few bucks more you might as well get that and have both.

CloneDVD does that same thing Shrink does and I can have it just dump the files like you do, and that's fine, but I choose to go with ISO's because it is easy to load onto the virtual drive and because they are ISO's I can use any disk burning program to burn a disk if I ever need one. For instance if I am going to travel or want to go to a friends house and watch something I can burn a disk in about six minutes and head out without having to take the original. And since it loads like it is a real disk my wife and kids won't get confused trying to find the right VOB file to get the movie going. Gotta make it simple for the wife. :p ;) Even more so it makes it much cleaner to navigate the collection. If it were just me I would remove all the extra stuff including the menus and use a program called Handbrake to encode it to MP4 files at around 800MB and save tons of disk space. But there is the wife thing again, and hard drives are cheap.

I use either Media Player Classic Home Cinema or VLC. Usually MPC HC. Actually getting ready put a system in the living room and hook it up to my TV as well as the same 5.1 surround speakers I have in my sig. Will get a wireless mouse to use as a remote.

Already tested it out with my laptop and everything was easy to use and worked great. My wired LAN is all on Gbit so no bandwidth issues. Actually haven't had any issues with the laptops on wireless either. No lag or stutter, even while I was ripping a movie while watching one at the same time. As a bonus I will also be able to watch movies online through my Netflix account on my TV without needing a gaming console or Netflix device.

I just set this all up last week. But I am really liking how it is working out. Just waiting on a video card to come back from RMA and will order the 5.1 system a little later when I have more cash on hand.

[Paul Komski]

Just wanted to say a big thank you. Since this thread began I downloaded and have now played around with VirtualBox. It is a far superior product to the MS offering in a number of ways - but particularly the ease of using its networking and the far superior way that it interfaces with all the hardware; sounds, usb, etc.

It also occurs to me that with appropriate hardware and host OS this a great way of creating an effective embedded system (just don't save the changes) to obviate attacks by whatever.

[jlreich]

A new convert. :D Though MS has its uses as well VB is definitely more versatile. And of course I can't use MS in Linux. There are actually several virtual machine programs for Linux but VB is the only one I could get consistent results with. Networking was a little more difficult in Linux but once I figured it out it is no problem now.

It also occurs to me that with appropriate hardware and host OS this a great way of creating an effective embedded system (just don't save the changes) to obviate attacks by whatever.
Absolutely. It's a great way to test things out while keeping your system safe.

[FrankSG]

After all the trial and errors (mostly errors) I finally have VB up and running with WinXP running within it. MY biggest challenge was to get it to find my external drive via the USB port, but I managed to get it to accomplish that.
I did try MS virtual machine but it didn't even see my CD ROM drive. I'm quite happy with VM. Doesn't this now make dual-booting somewhat obsolete?

[123456]

Windows 7 Pro and Ultimate have XP mode that's essentially a VM.

[FrankSG]

Windows 7 Pro and Ultimate have XP mode that's essentially a VM.
Yes, and I wish that Windows 7 Home Premium had it.

[jlreich]

Doesn't this now make dual-booting somewhat obsolete?
No it doesn't. Perhaps for your purposes it does, but it all depends on what you need to use another OS for. Virtual machines are not perfect emulators of your actual hardware. Particularly the video side of things. As already mentioned before you cannot play any but the most simple games in a VM. The hardware acceleration just does not translate well.

Things have been and are continuing to improve in this area. VB is definitely much better at giving you control of the hardware side than MS is, which is why I prefer it over MS. I do think in time we will see VM's actually running OS's in a near native hardware fashion. :)

Windows 7 Pro and Ultimate have XP mode that's essentially a VM.
It is indeed a VM. The only difference is MS has tied it together with 7 so that it can seem as though there is no VM running. But in fact it is XP running in a VM. That's why you have to download MS Virtual PC 2007 for it to work.